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Important notice for all renegade mapmakers [message #485888] Sun, 09 February 2014 15:04 Go to next message
jonwil is currently offline  jonwil
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It is VERY important that you run "object - check IDs" in leveledit and if any ID collisions are found, run "object - fix ID collisions" or otherwise renumber objects until there are no collisions left.

If your map runs fine in 1-player LAN but crashes the client when you load it on a server, this could well be the cause.


Jonathan Wilson aka Jonwil
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Re: Important notice for all renegade mapmakers [message #485914 is a reply to message #485888] Mon, 10 February 2014 04:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
jonwil is currently offline  jonwil
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The next scripts release will contain code to detect the duplicate-id issue (i.e. any time there are 2 objects with the same netcode ID) and give an error message/exit the game rather than just crashing or failing in weird ways.
That way people will know to fix their maps (or if its not their map, to go talk to whoever made it and get it fixed)


Jonathan Wilson aka Jonwil
Creator and Lead Coder of the Custom scripts.dll
Renegade Engine Guru
Creator and Lead Coder of TT.DLL
Official member of Tiberian Technologies
Re: Important notice for all renegade mapmakers [message #485916 is a reply to message #485888] Mon, 10 February 2014 04:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
danpaul88 is currently offline  danpaul88
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There are bound to be a LOT of custom maps out there with ID collisions that cannot be fixed because nobody has the source files and the person who made it is no longer in the community... are those maps going to simply be blocked with no way to use them in future?

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Re: Important notice for all renegade mapmakers [message #485931 is a reply to message #485888] Mon, 10 February 2014 11:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Mauler
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Well hopefully it can be done externally or something... We got a good number of custom maps running in UltraAOW... Might have to go in and recreate those levels in 4.1 tools... which is a huge task to take on Neutral
Re: Important notice for all renegade mapmakers [message #485941 is a reply to message #485888] Mon, 10 February 2014 13:30 Go to previous messageGo to next message
jonwil is currently offline  jonwil
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its a choice between giving s message or crashing/failing in wierd hard to debug ways.


Jonathan Wilson aka Jonwil
Creator and Lead Coder of the Custom scripts.dll
Renegade Engine Guru
Creator and Lead Coder of TT.DLL
Official member of Tiberian Technologies
Re: Important notice for all renegade mapmakers [message #485967 is a reply to message #485941] Tue, 11 February 2014 12:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jerad2142 is currently offline  Jerad2142
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It should be an option in the servers config to ignore the ID issues and attempt to run with them, I know there are a lot of ID collisions that can have no impact on the game what so ever. For example terrain ID collisions don't seem to cause any issues with the net code (at least if its just collisions with other terrain objects).

Waypoints also can be fine if they have collisions, as long as the object they collide with has a lower importance.


Re: Important notice for all renegade mapmakers [message #485974 is a reply to message #485888] Tue, 11 February 2014 14:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
jonwil is currently offline  jonwil
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It will only warn about ID collisions that actually affect the netcode, i.e. when 2 objects that send network data have the same network ID.


Jonathan Wilson aka Jonwil
Creator and Lead Coder of the Custom scripts.dll
Renegade Engine Guru
Creator and Lead Coder of TT.DLL
Official member of Tiberian Technologies
Re: Important notice for all renegade mapmakers [message #485981 is a reply to message #485888] Tue, 11 February 2014 15:00 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Gen_Blacky is currently offline  Gen_Blacky
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Most maps shouldn't have id collisions. I thought leveledit was good at managing that by auto setting different ids?
Not a common problem I have seen.


Jerad Gray wrote on Tue, 11 February 2014 12:51

It should be an option in the servers config to ignore the ID issues and attempt to run with them, I know there are a lot of ID collisions that can have no impact on the game what so ever. For example terrain ID collisions don't seem to cause any issues with the net code (at least if its just collisions with other terrain objects).

Waypoints also can be fine if they have collisions, as long as the object they collide with has a lower importance.



http://s18.postimage.org/jc6qbn4k9/bricks3.png

[Updated on: Tue, 11 February 2014 15:05]

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Re: Important notice for all renegade mapmakers [message #485983 is a reply to message #485888] Tue, 11 February 2014 15:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
jonwil is currently offline  jonwil
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The way it works is that anytime a network object is created/loaded by the game it basically says "if there is already a network object with the same id, print a message and end the game"

all items under "buildings" and "objects" have network objects, as do doors, elevators and certain other things under tiles (dont have the code handy right now to check which ones)

Terrain and waypaths dont have network objects so they wont be passing through this code.


Jonathan Wilson aka Jonwil
Creator and Lead Coder of the Custom scripts.dll
Renegade Engine Guru
Creator and Lead Coder of TT.DLL
Official member of Tiberian Technologies
Re: Important notice for all renegade mapmakers [message #485987 is a reply to message #485981] Tue, 11 February 2014 16:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jerad2142 is currently offline  Jerad2142
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Gen_Blacky wrote on Tue, 11 February 2014 15:00

Most maps shouldn't have id collisions. I thought leveledit was good at managing that by auto setting different ids?
Not a common problem I have seen.


Jerad Gray wrote on Tue, 11 February 2014 12:51

It should be an option in the servers config to ignore the ID issues and attempt to run with them, I know there are a lot of ID collisions that can have no impact on the game what so ever. For example terrain ID collisions don't seem to cause any issues with the net code (at least if its just collisions with other terrain objects).

Waypoints also can be fine if they have collisions, as long as the object they collide with has a lower importance.



There is a setting that allows you to set the start of the ID range, I haven't pinned down how far this range extends exactly however I have been able to pin down that when you delete objects off the map LE doesn't try to recycle the freed ID's by default. Instead, it continue to increment the ID from what it was last at, if you switch computers or reinstall LE the ID range will reset to what it was originally at, if you forget to bump it up it will allow you to place duplicate ID's all over the place.

ECW is up to 600000 for the main map now, and I completely forgot to bump it back up when I moved to my new computer, I started placing the new terrain, did a check ID and had over 400 ID conflicts.


Re: Important notice for all renegade mapmakers [message #486002 is a reply to message #485987] Wed, 12 February 2014 01:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Gen_Blacky is currently offline  Gen_Blacky
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Jerad Gray wrote on Tue, 11 February 2014 12:51


There is a setting that allows you to set the start of the ID range, I haven't pinned down how far this range extends exactly however I have been able to pin down that when you delete objects off the map LE doesn't try to recycle the freed ID's by default. Instead, it continue to increment the ID from what it was last at


Yea I have noticed that. Every new object gets auto incremented from the id it was last at. That's why I think it's odd anyone would ever have much trouble.

Quote:

if you switch computers or reinstall LE the ID range will reset to what it was originally at, if you forget to bump it up it will allow you to place duplicate ID's all over the place.


Really I have never noticed that and I have been using mod packages back from 2004 and reinstalled on several computers.

Quote:

ECW is up to 600000 for the main map now, and I completely forgot to bump it back up when I moved to my new computer, I started placing the new terrain, did a check ID and had over 400 ID conflicts.


That sounds like a horror story. When you have huge amount of presets and objects on a map like ecw and forget about the ids I can see how you would run into trouble.
I bet a simple tool could be made to fix that problem. At least I hope so for your sake.


http://s18.postimage.org/jc6qbn4k9/bricks3.png

[Updated on: Wed, 12 February 2014 01:18]

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Re: Important notice for all renegade mapmakers [message #486092 is a reply to message #486002] Fri, 14 February 2014 11:28 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jerad2142 is currently offline  Jerad2142
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Gen_Blacky wrote on Wed, 12 February 2014 01:17


Quote:

ECW is up to 600000 for the main map now, and I completely forgot to bump it back up when I moved to my new computer, I started placing the new terrain, did a check ID and had over 400 ID conflicts.


That sounds like a horror story. When you have huge amount of presets and objects on a map like ecw and forget about the ids I can see how you would run into trouble.
I bet a simple tool could be made to fix that problem. At least I hope so for your sake.

Running "object - fix ID collisions" like Jonwil says does work, I'm just wary of doing that as there are a few tile objects on the map that are referenced by scripts, as well as simple and vehicle, and I'm uncertain what priority what takes when correcting ID's, so I'd rather hand fix them then find out 3 months from now that San Casina has been crashing because a pop machine had its ID mapped wrong lol.


Re: Important notice for all renegade mapmakers [message #486107 is a reply to message #485888] Fri, 14 February 2014 12:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
danpaul88 is currently offline  danpaul88
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If you use the Check IDs option it'll tell you what the collisions are (if any) and leave it up to you to sort them out by hand.

There are other options that automatically go around fixing them, but Check IDs on its own won't.


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[Updated on: Fri, 14 February 2014 12:33]

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Re: Important notice for all renegade mapmakers [message #486112 is a reply to message #486107] Fri, 14 February 2014 13:39 Go to previous message
Jerad2142 is currently offline  Jerad2142
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danpaul88 wrote on Fri, 14 February 2014 12:32

If you use the Check IDs option it'll tell you what the collisions are (if any) and leave it up to you to sort them out by hand.

There are other options that automatically go around fixing them, but Check IDs on its own won't.

Indeed, but when it returns 200+ id collisions I usually just say fuck it and undo whatever it is that I did to cause it (usually place a new chunk of terrain before setting the id setting back up to where it should be).


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