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Some ideas on balance [message #492184] Fri, 14 April 2017 14:51 Go to next message
iRANian is currently offline  iRANian
Messages: 4300
Registered: April 2011
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General (4 Stars)
I don't like fake beacons, they really ought to be removed. They break the game if you play small games cause the attacking team has to go back to defend. In larger games it just causes your team to camp.

Proxy c4 ought to have 1 or 2 proxies before you can't just place proxies inside enemy buildings or around the field...using proxy c4 offensively is so lame.

The bug where Proxy C4 has a lot of range above characters need to be fixed..I've fixed it before by patching the detonate code for proxy C4 and lowering the Z-height distance check. This can prevent the gay shit where people place mines above doors.

Another issue is that if you hug a wall you take like 1/4th of the damage from a proxy C4...that ought to be fixed by lowering the range of Proxy C4 and boosting the damage output.

Remote C4 and Proxy C4 mine limit ought to seperated. Remote C4 limit ought to be per player instead of per team...4 remotes per player or something. C4 mine limit needs to be map dependent and higher than it is now. Ought to be able to mine all doors (+ stairs on flying maps) with 5 proxy c4's over. There ought to be a timed c4 limit of say 6 per player to prevent people 'vomiting' timed c4.

Proxy C4 planted on vehicles ought to be immediately disarmed. The game designers didn't think people would place ANY c4 on before TT scripts 4.0 (when WD fixed it) C4 would disappear if the planting location would be too far away from the current location (attached to vehicle).

When you plant a remote, timed c4 or proxy c4 it should show you the limit the c4 limits for that player/team. When you shoot a friendly c4 or press E on it, it should show you the player name of who planted it and the position of the proxy c4 in the mine limit queue (whether it was planted early or late).

You should be able to disarm your own c4 by shooting it or pressing 'E' on it.

When a player leaves the server his proxy c4 shouldn't disarm.

pointsmod is very lame and makes the game less fun, you get rewarded for repairing, shooting enemy buildings and destroying vehicles. Problem is most of the time you are teaming up with other players to destroy a vehicle and you won't get the credits for destroying it. Another issue is that if enemy tanks have Techs repairing them you won't be able to destroy them and you basically get no creds and no points lol. Creds are extremely slow on pointsmod servers which is why they run 2.5 creds a sec.

Another huge problem is that if your team has field and isn't destroying enemy tanks and isn't hitting enemy buildings...your team will start losing on points if the enemy get more vehicles kills than you. Pointsmod doesn't reward your team for field control, it always needs to be field control + shooting enemy buildings. You get almost no points/creds when using tanks defensively or not destroying enemy tanks lol.

With pointsmod, ramjet rifles need to be modded so they don't give insane creds/points...easy to do server-side. I'd also mod mammoth tank to give less points.

Creds should be about 2 creds per tick with PP. The Game should show the floating point value up to 2 numbers after the dot. so instead of showing "150" creds it should show "150.55" for example. Little nitpick of mine.

The following changes are really needed for marathon and longer than 40 min AOW games:

If PP is dead...cred income should be about 1.5 creds per tick and the Harvester ought to move slower by about 30-40%. 1 creds per tick is way too low if your team doesn't have field control. Your basically fucked if you don't have field control and pp is down.

If refinery is dead, you should be getting 0.5 creds per tick instead of 0 per tick.

If Barracks is dead you ought to be able to buy Gunner/LCG for 1600, tech char with less health (200 HP?) for 1500, 1 shot sniper/ramjet for 1500-2000. They can't pick up any weapons and neither can basic infantry if barracks is dead.

If wf/air is dead you ought to be able to buy vehicles for triple the price every 2 minutes or so...they will be transported in by Chinook.

I'd add extra versions of map server-side Guard Towers/Turret to every rush map plus some base defense maps like Hourglass (and disable agt/Obelisk on those maps).

**NOTE: I would increase the HP of Turrets and Guard Towers by 4-5 times.

I'd think it would be pretty interesting to play variations of rush maps with guard tower/turret and play base defence maps without agt/ob but with Guard Towers and Ob (or with no base defenses at all). So 2 variations of rush maps (no BD && Guard Tower/Turret) and 3 for base defence maps (BD, no BD && Guard Tower/Turret.

I would always disable AGT/OB on Hourglass, with two variations with no BD at all and AGT/OB. For HourGlass I would add server-side code which prevents players from hitting ref/pp from hill....but allow them to hit the other buildings from hill.

An interesting variation of HourGlass could be holing off the sides of the map with containers so you can only go on hill and on tunnel. Another variation could be holing off the hill so you can only go sides. Would be a funny clusterfuck.

I would have a variation of Volcano where players take no damage from Tib Field. I would have a variation of City_Fly/City without Stanks. I would also have a variation of Walls flying without flying units.

Another variation of City Fly/City would be holing off the WF and Hand sides so you can't rush WF and hand from them. Another variation would be to holing off bridge so you can't use it.

Glacier flying should be changed so that all the gay back-entries are placing some containers in the tunnels to block them off. This can be another variation as well. Plus a variation with no tunnels and no BD and a variation with no tunnels and only guard tower/turret.

A variation of Under could be holing off the hill area or the far side area where the bunkers are. Another variation could be where tib field does no damage.

Other variations could be adding invincible repair bays to maps.


The logic to destroy vehicles that have been flipped ought to be removed, I really don't see the benefit.

Screenshake needs to be enabled but Arty screenshake needs to be reduced.

pic/railgun are cheap as fuck against vehicles, no skill required...especially if you have light tank + railgun and you just repshoot.

Crates should always spawn in the middle (with multiple sites in middle) and the first crate(s) in the game need to be money. No death crate and no spy crate..

When game starts, there should be a 30 second countdown so everyone can load the game...and the first spawn on map load should be in the middle of the base outside so you don't get gay shit where people spawn in the back of the base and even after suiciding spawn in back of base.

Suicide should take about 5-10 seconds and not take all your money.

Tanks (except Arty) don't have enough range on their splash so it's incredibly hard to kill infantry (especially techs/hotwire).

The emitters for rocket and shell impact, flamethrower, chemsprayer etc is way too bright and white...there's a fix for it but most servers don't allow it.

I think clearscope ought to be banned...sniping is way too easy with clearscope.

SBH make the game a lot less fun...ought to be removed. Alternative would be to increase the cost, remove ability to enter vehicle, remove ability to pick up weapons and crates, reduce HP (200?) and remove timed C4 and maybe pistol. If fake beacons are removed it should be okay.

Long time and well respected Renegade community member, programmer, modder and tester.

Scripts 4.0 private beta tester since May 2011.

My Renegade server plugins releases
Re: Some ideas on balance [message #492193 is a reply to message #492184] Sat, 15 April 2017 10:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
ehhh is currently offline  ehhh
Messages: 2096
Registered: December 2010
Location: UK
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General (2 Stars)
would've been cool on jelly

but all servers have dumb mods on them anyway, making balance as retarded as ever
Re: Some ideas on balance [message #492197 is a reply to message #492184] Sat, 15 April 2017 11:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
iRANian is currently offline  iRANian
Messages: 4300
Registered: April 2011
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General (4 Stars)
Yeah that's true.

I don't mind having some mods for casual play but some of it really is over the top

Long time and well respected Renegade community member, programmer, modder and tester.

Scripts 4.0 private beta tester since May 2011.

My Renegade server plugins releases
Re: Some ideas on balance [message #492415 is a reply to message #492184] Wed, 07 June 2017 17:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
liquidv2 is currently offline  liquidv2
Messages: 3407
Registered: February 2007
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General (3 Stars)
the bit about NO c4 on any vehicles seems odd - they didn't plan for players to attack enemy vehicles with c4? I understand allied ones, but it does the same for them as well

some of your ideas are strange to me, but they're intended to keep the game afloat and give the losing team a better hope or chance to win (a reason to keep playing, basically)

pointmod servers make sense for competitive games, but it really shits on a public server when all the players aren't try-hards
GDI has a hell of a time when the Nod base is under siege, because all focused fire is basically on the teched arties or Nod will break out in a heartbeat - that means buildings are not being hit, and Nod is actually winning on points much of the time in that exchange (as strange as that is)

a vacant proxy c4 killing someone after the c4 planter has left might confuse the bots or the server - that might cause issues, but I'm sure they could be sorted out

sbh should not be able to enter any vehicles, friend or foe - this includes a spy, and a player running over a spy crate in a vehicle would continue to not become a spy (I think that's how it's always been, so just keep it that way)
this would also allow GDI players to field-rep safely, just like Nod players have always been able to

sbh dropping beacons always has been and always will be OP, but what if it took them longer to deploy them or something?

sbh being able to pick up weapons is also stupidly OP - you should limit what they can pick up, and absolutely disallow them from carrying extra c4

if PICs and Ravs weren't a thing you'd be able to balance vehicle damage much better, but removing them would cause infinite sadness

I'm not sure what you mean when you said ramjets give insane points on a pointmod server

disabling the main base defenses on Hourglass is a great idea, but it would be way too easy for Nod to kill the Guard Towers and let sbh run amok in the base
maybe having the Guard Towers respawning after a period of 5 or 10 minutes or something would be a good thought - teamwork would be required to take advantage of that time window of opportunity

having City or City_Flying without the bridge would be strange, but might alter the gameplay
something they did on World of Tanks was add a game mode on some existing maps that changed the bases, so rather than each team having its assigned side there was one neutral base elsewhere on the map and both teams had to try and capture it or destroy the enemy team
simply doing that was enough to change how those maps were played in those instances, and I feel it's a good way to vary gameplay without necessarily requiring new maps altogether - your idea largely does the same, but in a different way

Renegade Theory lives on

Re: Some ideas on balance [message #492416 is a reply to message #492184] Wed, 07 June 2017 17:32 Go to previous message
liquidv2 is currently offline  liquidv2
Messages: 3407
Registered: February 2007
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General (3 Stars)

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