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Re: BHS Ladder [message #438576 is a reply to message #438525] Fri, 29 October 2010 16:29 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
liquidv2 is currently offline  liquidv2
Messages: 3407
Registered: February 2007
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General (3 Stars)
i'm gonna ask CarrierII or Gozy to split this, i think the ladder discussion is important

Quote:

shall i repeat one of the things i kept saying about how the point bug affected clanwars?

renegade's overall prosperity and survival as a whole has less to do with clanwars than you think
the majority of ren players don't play competitive renegade
i said what i said about the pointmod based on what i've noticed over time

Quote:

perhaps you also remember that i listed everyone who was outraged at the thought of the game being fairer; it was no coincidence that every single one of them had a track record of cheating, pointpushing, rulebreaking, dishonesty etc - something i kept pointing out to you over and over again and i couldn't seem to get you to care about. you think a cheater and compulsive liar like robo's opinion on how a league should be run is worth as much as mine?

you listed several players that openly disagreed via the clanwars forums with your decision to use the pointmod in clanwars
you act as if those players were the only ones that didn't want it used in clanwars; the majority if the league did not want it used, and those players did not make up the majority alone
and don't talk about robo, the whole c4smoke CVS thing has done enough for the kid
let his renputation rest peacefully

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they didn't trust or stand by me,

yah they did; why do you think they stuck around?

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they actively tried to sabotage the league through a campaign of lies, rigged polls and manipulation.

what do you mean sabotage the league?

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for example, they went secretly to the clanwars server owners and totally lied about what was going on in the forums at the time to get them to change the server settings.

that's a bitch move, but if the servers were not set to your settings then by default the games would mean nothing
sure their settings would be in place, but you could put a dead stop to your ladder until they agree to play by your rules

Quote:

indeed, and the people you were so staunchly siding with didn't want it to be a democracy either, though unlike me they lied to you and said they did. again, perhaps you missed people like simpee and karmai saying whose opinions count and whose don't, depending on how good you are - and, get this, simpee saying whiskey's vote shouldn't count because he happened to agree with spoony.

their opinions were biased and you know that, so why does it bother you so much when they said or did stupid things? i thought it was douchey of you to go against your playerbase
if it makes them happy why not keep it?

Quote:

sure, if they want to lie. i didn't ignore my player base, it's an absurd and desperate lie to say i did. i went to extraordinary lengths to encourage debate on the subject. the "player base" you're talking about, which is another euphemism for a small number of cheaters and rulebreakers and compulsive liars - ignored me.

it's more a poor choice of words than a desperate lie, instead you went against your player base
the majority of your league at the time was cheaters, rulebreakers, and compulsive liars? i think we've had this discussion before, because that's what i said the last time you said that
and i already addressed that, because these cheaters, rulebreakers, and compulsive liars you listed at the time were not the only people against using the pointmod in clanwars

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ah, i see the problem. you think i should make decisions that please people who don't want the game to be fair. well, as long as we disagree on that we won't agree on much else either.

if that's the majority of your league then why not? do you host the league to satisfy yourself?

Quote:

saying you supported the campaign of lies and manipulation by a group of cheaters to subvert and sabotage someone else's community because they were angry at not getting their way in that community is a simple description of the facts.

i had their campaign posters all over my bedroom walls
who said i supported the way they went about it? i never said i supported them rigging polls or lying to server owners to get the servers changed without your permission

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it all boiled down a question of whether an individual server/league/whatever is entitled to choose in its own way whether to use the pointsfix or not, and make no mistake, you weren't on the right side. while these cheaters were sabotaging a community because they were furious at the decisions not being made by THEM ALONE, your entire commentary on the situation was telling me that i should do what this small number of cheaters and pointpushers demanded. honestly, i hope you realise how much of a fucking retard you were being at the time

i disagree; i told you you had every right to do it
multiple times i might add
i said i was confused as to why you didn't side with the majority of your league
it's unfortunate that the small number of cheaters, pointpushers, and compulsive liars were a part of that majority of your league, but that's just the way it is
or was

Quote:

they posted a huge list of accusations against me, most of which would be worse than cheating if they were true - and every one of which they were knowingly lying about. why do you say "they said spoony was stubborn"?

did you ask them to make a list? lol
i thought that in one of their posts, like the one where they said "Screw the ladder it's bullshit," that they said you were stubborn or something along those lines
if it wasn't then then it may have been another time, or not at all, but it's something i can see either of them saying even if they didn't
does it matter?
and you should have been thrilled that they made a big list openly like that, it allowed you to publically clear up grievances and accusations
they could have been lying compulsively but what if their accusations were things they truly believe?

Quote:

it's true that their attempt to sabotage the TT ladder didn't get as far as their earlier attempt to sabotage the clanwars ladder IN EXACTLY THE SAME WAY FOR EXACTLY THE SAME REASON.

what attempt? you're exaggerating in an obesely disgusting manner
they said in their own words Fuck the TT ladder, it's stupid, forget about it
you're acting like they led rallies and marched to the EA headquarters with anti-spoony t-shirt and Fuck TT signs
i don't get why you're shouting, i guess simpee and clear must make you really mad
maybe that's why you banned them!
you mean to tell me they made a post saying Fuck Spoony and his clanwars ladder that was similar to their post about the TT ladder post? this is an outrage
what else did they do to sabotage the clanwars ladder? lie to clanwars server owners in an attempt to get it changed? perhaps they're just very confused individuals and weren't intentionally lying to them, but were instead telling them what they believed to be true

liquidv2

[Updated on: Fri, 29 October 2010 16:30]

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