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Re: Why did you vote for Obama? [message #362187 is a reply to message #362184]

Tue, 09 December 2008 11:14

Spoony
Messages: 3915
Registered: January 2006

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Point needs making to darkknight. I find cheesesoda's view rather silly (although considerably less silly and definitely less morally repugnant than Christianity), although as an atheist I have no problem with him believing it, as long as he doesn't use it to interfere with other people's lives (and it's hard to see how that could happen) or teach it to children as though it were factual with evidence supporting it.

That's the key. Christianity is every bit as unsupported, every bit as guesswork as the above; what is immoral (and hugely dishonest) is when these guesses are taught as though they are anything more than guesswork. In supposedly secular Britain (in a non-faith school at that), they are taught as fact, with the same certainty as what we are taught in maths or science. This is brainwashing, plain and simple. But hey, like you say, "make your own choice when you're 18". As if you can make an informed choice when you've been lied to all your life! If your education had told you that the Nazis were good people, highlighted the positive changes National Socialism had on German society (I expect there are a few, but I don't have the stomach to look for them, frankly), and told them nothing about the final solution or WW2, you could then ask them when they're 18 if they would like to join the Nazi Party. Some of them might say yes.

But that's enough about scientific truth; another point needs making about morality. I put it to everybody here that if there was no religious instruction to children, the world will become a vastly better place in the timeframe of one generation. Look at Islam; every time you read about a suicide bomber, you'll hear the usual whining about Israel and George W. Bush, but nobody wants to pay attention to the revelation (which is always there in any interview) that these murderers were motivated by religion, the promise that they would go straight to paradise for doing what they do. This is not rhetoric, they actually believe what they say they believe, and the reason so many do is because of the stranglehold religion has on education in so much of the world; because ridiculous guesswork is presented as fact.

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		Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Thu, 06 November 2008 05:24
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Starbuzzz on Thu, 06 November 2008 07:31
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Thu, 06 November 2008 15:48
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Ma1kel on Thu, 06 November 2008 07:34
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: z310 on Thu, 06 November 2008 09:05
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: AmunRa on Fri, 07 November 2008 15:38
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Ryan3k on Sun, 09 November 2008 09:57
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Starbuzzz on Sun, 09 November 2008 13:35
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Sun, 09 November 2008 10:18
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Herr Surth on Sun, 09 November 2008 11:16
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Sun, 09 November 2008 11:20
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Herr Surth on Sun, 09 November 2008 12:13
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Sun, 09 November 2008 12:49
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Herr Surth on Sun, 09 November 2008 14:05
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Dover on Tue, 09 December 2008 15:16
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: GEORGE ZIMMER on Sun, 09 November 2008 12:27
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: liquidv2 on Sun, 09 November 2008 13:19
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Sun, 09 November 2008 14:56
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Rocko on Sun, 09 November 2008 15:04
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Mon, 10 November 2008 22:03
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: TD on Mon, 10 November 2008 22:26
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Tue, 11 November 2008 06:09
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Starbuzzz on Tue, 11 November 2008 19:31
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Herr Surth on Wed, 12 November 2008 03:26
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Starbuzzz on Wed, 12 November 2008 06:46
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: MGamer on Wed, 12 November 2008 13:32
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Tue, 11 November 2008 22:44
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: liquidv2 on Thu, 13 November 2008 01:49
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Thu, 13 November 2008 05:26
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: [NE]Fobby[GEN] on Sun, 09 November 2008 18:24
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Starbuzzz on Sun, 09 November 2008 18:48
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: u6795 on Sun, 09 November 2008 19:48
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: _SSnipe_ on Tue, 11 November 2008 21:54
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Ethenal on Sun, 09 November 2008 19:53
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: u6795 on Sun, 09 November 2008 19:57
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Herr Surth on Mon, 10 November 2008 05:51
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Barack Obama on Mon, 10 November 2008 11:49
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: MGamer on Mon, 10 November 2008 12:42
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: GEORGE ZIMMER on Mon, 10 November 2008 12:24
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: u6795 on Mon, 10 November 2008 12:39
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Barack Obama on Mon, 10 November 2008 20:26
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: JPNOD on Sat, 15 November 2008 02:37
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Sat, 15 November 2008 08:18
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Rocko on Sun, 16 November 2008 22:31
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: bisen11 on Mon, 17 November 2008 00:55
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Ryan3k on Tue, 18 November 2008 20:58
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Berkut on Wed, 19 November 2008 10:14
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: u6795 on Wed, 19 November 2008 12:42
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: MGamer on Wed, 19 November 2008 19:52
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: CarrierII on Thu, 20 November 2008 14:49
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Sun, 23 November 2008 10:23
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: u6795 on Sun, 23 November 2008 10:27
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Sun, 23 November 2008 10:33
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Ma1kel on Wed, 19 November 2008 05:30
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: luv2pb on Thu, 20 November 2008 14:23
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Herr Surth on Sun, 23 November 2008 11:18
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Sun, 23 November 2008 11:38
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Sun, 23 November 2008 11:51
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: [NE]Fobby[GEN] on Sun, 23 November 2008 12:04
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Ma1kel on Mon, 24 November 2008 06:05
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: NukeIt15 on Mon, 24 November 2008 08:41
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Ma1kel on Mon, 24 November 2008 11:25
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Berkut on Tue, 25 November 2008 20:46
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Wed, 26 November 2008 07:52
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Ryan3k on Wed, 26 November 2008 13:22
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Ryan3k on Mon, 24 November 2008 14:49
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Mon, 24 November 2008 15:07
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Starbuzzz on Tue, 25 November 2008 06:57
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Tue, 25 November 2008 10:59
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Wed, 26 November 2008 08:24
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Wed, 26 November 2008 10:24
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Wed, 26 November 2008 14:27
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: [NE]Fobby[GEN] on Wed, 26 November 2008 16:30
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Wed, 26 November 2008 16:45
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Starbuzzz on Wed, 26 November 2008 16:51
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Berkut on Wed, 26 November 2008 22:01
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: GEORGE ZIMMER on Fri, 28 November 2008 07:56
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Rocko on Fri, 28 November 2008 21:32
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Sat, 29 November 2008 00:23
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Spoony on Sat, 29 November 2008 05:32
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: GoArmy44 on Sat, 29 November 2008 13:16
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Ma1kel on Sat, 29 November 2008 07:21
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Spoony on Sat, 29 November 2008 11:39
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Ma1kel on Sat, 29 November 2008 11:43
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Spoony on Sat, 29 November 2008 11:48
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Sat, 29 November 2008 13:11
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Spoony on Sun, 30 November 2008 08:18
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: GoArmy44 on Tue, 02 December 2008 21:43
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Herr Surth on Wed, 03 December 2008 06:27
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: GoArmy44 on Wed, 03 December 2008 22:00
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: u6795 on Sat, 29 November 2008 20:35
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Sun, 30 November 2008 09:57
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: u6795 on Sun, 30 November 2008 14:24
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Spoony on Mon, 01 December 2008 05:40
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Mon, 01 December 2008 07:33
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Spoony on Wed, 03 December 2008 05:55
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Wed, 03 December 2008 06:59
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Spoony on Wed, 03 December 2008 09:42
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Sun, 30 November 2008 15:22
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Ryan3k on Sun, 30 November 2008 16:47
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Nunya on Tue, 02 December 2008 12:15
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Ryan3k on Tue, 02 December 2008 20:04
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Nunya on Tue, 02 December 2008 12:24
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Tue, 02 December 2008 13:15
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Herr Surth on Wed, 03 December 2008 07:00
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Wed, 03 December 2008 07:02
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Herr Surth on Wed, 03 December 2008 07:23
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Ma1kel on Wed, 03 December 2008 08:02
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Herr Surth on Wed, 03 December 2008 08:15
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Wed, 03 December 2008 08:54
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Herr Surth on Wed, 03 December 2008 09:25
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Wed, 03 December 2008 09:49
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: u6795 on Wed, 03 December 2008 12:41
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Ma1kel on Fri, 05 December 2008 07:47
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: u6795 on Fri, 05 December 2008 12:38
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Ma1kel on Sat, 06 December 2008 08:08
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Sat, 06 December 2008 09:00
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Ma1kel on Sat, 06 December 2008 23:18
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Sun, 07 December 2008 08:26
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Spoony on Sat, 06 December 2008 15:55
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Spoony on Thu, 04 December 2008 06:40
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Wed, 03 December 2008 12:58
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: GEORGE ZIMMER on Thu, 04 December 2008 11:15
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Spoony on Fri, 05 December 2008 01:21
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: GEORGE ZIMMER on Sun, 07 December 2008 13:31
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Spoony on Sun, 07 December 2008 13:53
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Ryan3k on Thu, 04 December 2008 14:21
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Ma1kel on Fri, 05 December 2008 08:14
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Ma1kel on Fri, 05 December 2008 10:03
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Fri, 05 December 2008 14:08
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Herr Surth on Sat, 06 December 2008 09:54
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Sun, 07 December 2008 08:31
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Starbuzzz on Sun, 07 December 2008 08:35
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Spoony on Sun, 07 December 2008 12:03
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Sun, 07 December 2008 18:25
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Starbuzzz on Sun, 07 December 2008 23:27
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Spoony on Mon, 08 December 2008 03:48
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Ma1kel on Mon, 08 December 2008 06:18
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Sun, 07 December 2008 09:17
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Sun, 07 December 2008 09:24
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Sun, 07 December 2008 09:49
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Sun, 07 December 2008 09:55
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Ryan3k on Sun, 07 December 2008 10:40
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Spoony on Sun, 07 December 2008 12:52
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: u6795 on Mon, 08 December 2008 04:41
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Spoony on Mon, 08 December 2008 04:51
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Jecht on Mon, 08 December 2008 06:16
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Spoony on Mon, 08 December 2008 18:17
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Mon, 08 December 2008 06:44
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Jecht on Mon, 08 December 2008 06:51
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Mon, 08 December 2008 08:08
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Jecht on Mon, 08 December 2008 08:28
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Mon, 08 December 2008 08:45
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Jecht on Mon, 08 December 2008 08:55
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Jecht on Mon, 08 December 2008 19:04
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Spoony on Mon, 08 December 2008 19:27
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Mon, 08 December 2008 19:41
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Spoony on Tue, 09 December 2008 07:41
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Jecht on Tue, 09 December 2008 15:07
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Spoony on Wed, 10 December 2008 06:02
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Wed, 10 December 2008 06:24
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Spoony on Wed, 10 December 2008 07:35
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Wed, 10 December 2008 18:59
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Dover on Wed, 10 December 2008 22:25
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Wed, 10 December 2008 22:44
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Dover on Thu, 11 December 2008 01:06
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Thu, 11 December 2008 06:15
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Spoony on Thu, 11 December 2008 08:15
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Jecht on Wed, 10 December 2008 12:20
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Spoony on Wed, 10 December 2008 13:11
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Wed, 10 December 2008 18:21
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Dover on Wed, 10 December 2008 18:41
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Jecht on Wed, 10 December 2008 20:36
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Jecht on Tue, 09 December 2008 04:09
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Mon, 08 December 2008 19:53
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Tue, 09 December 2008 07:11
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Spoony on Tue, 09 December 2008 07:58
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Tue, 09 December 2008 09:11
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Spoony on Tue, 09 December 2008 09:57
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Tue, 09 December 2008 10:40
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Spoony on Tue, 09 December 2008 11:14
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Mon, 08 December 2008 20:52
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Herr Surth on Tue, 09 December 2008 04:56
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Tue, 09 December 2008 06:04
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Mon, 08 December 2008 21:15
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Mon, 08 December 2008 21:44
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Mon, 08 December 2008 22:01
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Mon, 08 December 2008 22:03
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: NukeIt15 on Mon, 08 December 2008 21:31
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: nikki6ixx on Mon, 08 December 2008 21:54
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Mon, 08 December 2008 22:16
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Tue, 09 December 2008 00:09
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Tue, 09 December 2008 06:35
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: DarkKnight on Tue, 09 December 2008 06:38
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Herr Surth on Tue, 09 December 2008 06:20
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Herr Surth on Tue, 09 December 2008 06:45
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Herr Surth on Tue, 09 December 2008 09:59
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Herr Surth on Tue, 09 December 2008 11:47
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Tue, 09 December 2008 16:09
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Dover on Tue, 09 December 2008 16:16
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Wed, 10 December 2008 07:10
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Wed, 10 December 2008 18:34
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: u6795 on Wed, 10 December 2008 18:43
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Wed, 10 December 2008 20:48
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: liquidv2 on Wed, 10 December 2008 21:08
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Wed, 10 December 2008 21:34
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Ma1kel on Wed, 17 December 2008 08:21
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: liquidv2 on Wed, 10 December 2008 21:43
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Jecht on Thu, 11 December 2008 11:56
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Fabian on Tue, 16 December 2008 17:13
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: NukeIt15 on Tue, 16 December 2008 18:21
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Fabian on Tue, 16 December 2008 23:58
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Dover on Wed, 17 December 2008 00:28
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Wed, 17 December 2008 08:03
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Wed, 17 December 2008 08:24
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Ma1kel on Wed, 17 December 2008 10:45
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: u6795 on Wed, 17 December 2008 13:21
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Wed, 17 December 2008 13:26
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: nikki6ixx on Wed, 17 December 2008 13:27
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Ma1kel on Wed, 17 December 2008 13:28
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: u6795 on Wed, 17 December 2008 14:01
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: cheesesoda on Wed, 17 December 2008 13:39
		Re: Why did you vote for Obama? By: Ma1kel on Wed, 17 December 2008 14:03

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