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Re: Political Compass [message #338140 is a reply to message #338135] Sun, 29 June 2008 19:54 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
Starbuzzz
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cheesesoda wrote on Sun, 29 June 2008 20:00

How can that not apply to the Soviet Union? IT FUCKING HAPPENED. Perhaps I'll send to you, in a PM, the chapter of Neal Boortz's book that talks about his trip to soviet Russia. Talk about low productivity and lack of interest in improving.


Did he meet the highest minds of the Soviet state? He talked to the well guarded space engineers and scientists? Civil engineers? We are talking about the brightest minds in Russia who were enslaved under the centralized command economy and that kept them from doing what they wanted.

Communism (in Russia) allowed all invention and innovation from it's engineers and scientists but it (the Communist Party) had the final say in what they wanted to be implemented. They controlled the funds and they controlled the lives.

So, it was not like they were all lazy sloppy rats who were content with what they had. They had most things on the table but only the innovation the state wanted was allowed to progress to a protoype stage. This is why you see a massive influence in Soviet military R&D. That was the prime concern of the state; defense. You will also see that more technological strides were made after Stalin's death.

But they applied regular communist idealogy when it comes to dealing with their citizens. For example the Lada cars. A imported/bundled up car that was worse than a donkey (atleast did not crap) but it fulfilled the needs to getting from point A to point B and therefore did not need to be improved. If they were not being uptight like that, we would have seen more advances in the civilian sector.

Look at what Russians are capable of (and were always capable of) when all the rules and bans in imagination was lifted:
http://cache.jalopnik.com/assets/resources/2007/03/lada_c_geneva.JPG

They could and would have done the same under Soviet times as they always had the talent but the state was not interested in fancy things.

No wonder Boortz came back with a stark report...probably saw the hopeless citizens who was working at the same factory for 30 years with no change to their pathetic lives.

cheesesoda wrote on Sun, 29 June 2008 20:00

Oh, and tell the Cubans they're at the forefront of technology.


The Cubans were, are, and will be rats. They never had and never will get access to any resources nor do they have a productive infrastructure to showcase their talents (if they got any).

cheesesoda wrote on Sun, 29 June 2008 20:00

Why don't you actually try to fucking understand what I was talking about in terms of having the US as competition?


I did not see it in any other way.

cheesesoda wrote on Sun, 29 June 2008 20:00

I didn't say America forced them to hurry up.


But you said, or atleast pressed the point that American pressure (competitive or otherwise) made them to churn out new technologies.

cheesesoda wrote on Sun, 29 June 2008 20:00

I was merely remarking on the fact that two world powers emerged from the ruins of WWII. That was America and Russia. With Stalin running the country, it doesn't take a stretch of the imagination to see that he forced his scientists to produce new technologies to stay ahead of America, in order to be the largest super power. The new technologies weren't created out of a Communist society. They were created out of desperation to not be killed by Stalin.


The Soviets always saw themselves as the leaders of Europe. They had ambitions to extend Russian territory to the Atlantic (a lofty dream).

Stalin wanted Soviet Russia to become the greatest power in Europe. Don't forget the guy was paranoid to a degree that had affected no man before and after him. The loss the Soviets suffered was great during the war...he wanted to make sure the Soviets would never suffer like that again at the hand of the enemy. The land the Soviets grabbed was key to creating protective buffer states.

To protect and most importantly, keep control, over these new buffer states, the Soviets had no choice but to increase their already big military...in case to crush oppositions. Then the Cold War came because 2 giants realized to themselves that another giant as big as itself lived nearby...hence the invitable rivalry.

cheesesoda wrote on Sun, 29 June 2008 20:00

Don't honor (you're an American, you smug asshole, spell like one) my "lack of" understanding, then.


I threw that in deliberately.

http://img30.imageshack.us/img30/8746/buzzsigfinal.jpg

[Updated on: Sun, 29 June 2008 19:56]

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