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Re: 45% of Americans believe that humans did not evolve [message #335085 is a reply to message #335078] Fri, 13 June 2008 07:45 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
GEORGE ZIMMER is currently offline  GEORGE ZIMMER
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Spoony

Garbage. If all you do is say "yeah, I think there probably is a God" if someone asks you, that doesn't make you religious. Agreeing with the theory of evolution and the Big Bang isn't a religion in any sense of the definition. You may as well say atheism is just another religion.

Being "religious" and believing in a form of religion are generally two different things. It's like calling someone a racist because they said something that could be interpreted as racist. I don't know why almost every athiest/"non religion believer" thinks they're oh-so-different than others because they believe in God in a different way (That he doesn't exist). You're not, it just means you have a seperate belief than others. But it's still a belief regarding similar aspects of religions.

Christianity apperently explains how the world was created, and who created us. Yes, there is ALOT more to it than that, but surely a belief that large would have much more to it.

Evolution apperently explains how the world was creared, and who didn't create us. Yes, there is ALOT more to it than that, but surely a belief that large would have much more to it.

Spoony

There's no code of conduct you have to follow, no meetings you need to attend, no 'clergy' or historical figures you have to pay any particular level of respect to, no promise of divine reward or threat of after-death punishment if you misbehave... these are what defines religions, not just agreeing with a theory someone put forward. The same would be true if you just said "yeah, I think there probably is a god".

Just because that's how you define a religion isn't how everyone else defines it. See previous posts regarding rationality.

Yeah, that might seem contradictory, but look at it for a sec. I'm asking that people who believe in what created us and whatnot be classified under other people who believe that something created us (The big bang counts as something, believe it or not). Why? Well, it annoys me, and I'm sure it annoys others, that athiests, evolutionists, and many other people along those lines consider themselves "above" or "seperate" from the "religious" people because they believe in something "better". Really, if you look at it, I'm sure that you get pissed off when a Christian takes a "holier-than-thou" attitude when you tell them you believe that the process of evolution is what created us.

Yet at the same time, think about how many times you've pretty much said to yourself, if not to others, "This guy's a nutjob, I'm obviously more intelligent" when you argue/debate about religion. I've seen it many times. So in that respect, there's a fairly large similarity between evolutionists and Christians- they both always think they're right, and the other is wrong.

Granted, this doesn't apply to EVERY evolutionist and Christian out there, but still. The majority of Christians think they're right, and that's the end of the story. The majority of athiests/evolutionists/whatever think they're right, and that's the end of the story.

But wait, how can BOTH be right, and the other be wrong? Surely, there must be a middle ground. Or, there's parts of the other religion that are wrong, and there's a middle ground between the two.

That's why I generally take the stance I do. I don't go to church, I don't go to confession, I don't constantly read the bible, I don't always do some sort of daily/weekly tribute. But I have a belief regarding the creation of the universe, and I consider myself one who believes in a religion.

You can say all you want that those things define a religion, but why do they? There's another similarity that they all share. They believe that something happened that created them. It's pretty much like saying a tank and a soldier are entirely different things because the tank has a lot more around it than the soldier.

But in the end, they're both tools of war. That's what we call seperate divisions or somesuch (Can't think of the exact military terms right now), but they're still part of the military.

The same can be applied to religion. The tank being Christianity, and the soldier being the evolutionist. The "military" and their goals being religion.

But wait, according to you, the soldier is then not a part of the military because of the fact that the tank is the military. Surely, even though they have different goals, this must mean that because they are radically different, there's no possible way they could have the same goals and therefore be classified under a greater definition... Right?

Oh wait...

Spoony


See, I am inclined to believe the theories that the big bang took place and that evolution is happening, but those "beliefs" don't demand or promise anything at all from/to me other than if someone asks me, I'd say "Yeah, I think they probably did happen"

See, I am inclined to believe the theories that the big bang is possible, and that evolution is a fact, but that it did not create us and that a greater being atleast guided evolution in its favor, but those "beliefs" don't demand or promise anything at all from/to me other than if someone asks me, I'd say "Yeah, I think that probably did happen".

Yet I still consider what I believe to be a religion.

Spoony


Listen to how ridiculous you sound. As if someone needs to justify their atheism/apatheism (because I consider myself an apatheist, not an atheist). As if we're the ones with any explaining to do...

You know, it's just as ridiculous saying someone doesn't need to justify their actions or belief. Really, you should always have good reasoning and judgement behind your beliefs, no matter what they are. If an athiest/evolutionist cannot justify why they believe what they do.

If a highly religious person walks up to you and asks why you believe in what you do, does that still mean you don't need to justify it? If all you can say to them is "because I can", you're as ridiculous as that guy who has a "god hates fags" sign. Blindly following a belief is still blindly following it, no matter what the belief is.

However, if you DO have reasoning behind it, then there you go. That's justification. Not neccisarily GOOD reasoning and whatnot, but, y'know.

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