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As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... [message #128385]

Wed, 22 December 2004 11:29

NeoSaber
Messages: 336
Registered: February 2003

Karma:

Recruit

SuperFlyingEngi

You have seen pictures from Abu Gharib of people being attacked by dogs, haven't you? That's what I would be led to believe is the most likely avenue. And torture is not just limited to being hit with a real big stick. Dictionary.com defines it as Excruciating physical or mental pain. That's what we were subjecting people at Abu Gharib to, and that wasn't the only incident, apparently.

Dictionary.com says torture includes excrutiating mental pain. How is sleep deprivation excrutiating? I've been deprived of sleep for a couple days before. It was annoying, not excrutiating. Stress positions? Being hand cuffed to the floor doesn't count as excruciating in my book. Growling dogs? (Note: I've changed from barking to growling based on the news reports on this that I saw yesterday). I've had plenty of dogs bark at me. It can be scary, not excrutiating. Then there's the hood wearing. I can't see (pun intended) how being blindfolded for a while counts as excrutiating.

SuperFlyingEngi

How do you know what's in the executive order if you haven't seen it? That's the whole point of this article, some people in the FBI leaked documents to the ACLU, and the ACLU went to court suing under the Free Information Act or whatever to ascertain whether or not there was an executive order, because all the evidence seems to point to there being one. And that's where we are right now.

They say in the article they know what's in the executive order. I'll admit, I mis-read that originally. I thought they meant they already had it when they were just saying they know what's in it, despite not having it. That lack of evidence is what they are citing when they say Bush authorized sleep deprivation, stress positions, etc. Citing evidence they didn't have confused me at first into thinking they had the evidence, I should have known better though.

It never says they are after the executive order. At the end, the article says:

Quote:

The ACLU and its allies are scheduled to go to court again this afternoon, where they will seek an order compelling the CIA to turn over records related to an internal investigation into detainee abuse.

They don't say they are after the executive order. They want records they claim exist about internal investigations into abuse.

SuperFlyingEngi

These documents weren't intended to come out. They were leaked by federal employees. That's not the same thing as freely distributing them, FYI.

I didn't see anything about them being leaked to the ACLU. I'm just going by the article you posted about. In that article it says the documents came from a lawsuit the ACLU filed:

Quote:

The documents were obtained after the ACLU and other public interest organizations filed a lawsuit against the government for failing to respond to a Freedom of Information Act request.

By the way, you said:

SuperFlyingEngi

And guess what? This story will NEVER make the media outlets unless it snowballs, because they are not news. Don't feign yourselves into thinking they are.

Like I said above, I have seen a few stories on this already. The first story I saw was basically saying what the ACLU said verbatim. The only exception being, the story said "growling dogs" instead of "use of dogs". It was Fox News that ran these stories, I haven't watched the other channels enough to know if they are talking about it.

I don't think the story will go much further unless the media gets bored, as there isn't really a story here. Most of what the ACLU said is already known information. I'd even heard of that executive order months ago. I think I saw it being were debated on O'Reilly. Regardless of what some may think about him, he has some of the highest rating of the news channels. If he was talking about it, then people know.

If you want to get into big stories the media missed, I know of one where there's video of John Kerry, at a democratic fundraiser, taking money from known terrorists. Very Happy

NeoSaber

Renegade Map Maker at CnC Source
Animator/Compiler/Level Editor/Object Rigger/Programmer for Red Alert: A Path Beyond

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[Message index]

		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: SuperFlyingEngi on Mon, 20 December 2004 19:37
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cheesesoda on Mon, 20 December 2004 19:42
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cowmisfit on Mon, 20 December 2004 19:45
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: SuperFlyingEngi on Mon, 20 December 2004 19:47
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cowmisfit on Mon, 20 December 2004 19:53
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cheesesoda on Mon, 20 December 2004 19:54
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cowmisfit on Mon, 20 December 2004 19:57
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: MilkyLep on Mon, 20 December 2004 19:59
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: DarkDemin on Mon, 20 December 2004 20:02
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cowmisfit on Mon, 20 December 2004 20:04
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: SuperFlyingEngi on Mon, 20 December 2004 20:06
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cheesesoda on Mon, 20 December 2004 20:08
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: SuperFlyingEngi on Mon, 20 December 2004 20:11
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: MilkyLep on Mon, 20 December 2004 20:16
		Re: As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: icedog90 on Mon, 20 December 2004 20:17
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cowmisfit on Mon, 20 December 2004 20:17
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cheesesoda on Mon, 20 December 2004 20:17
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: SuperFlyingEngi on Mon, 20 December 2004 20:21
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cowmisfit on Mon, 20 December 2004 20:23
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cheesesoda on Mon, 20 December 2004 20:24
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: MilkyLep on Mon, 20 December 2004 20:26
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: icedog90 on Mon, 20 December 2004 20:27
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: SuperFlyingEngi on Mon, 20 December 2004 20:28
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cowmisfit on Mon, 20 December 2004 20:29
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cheesesoda on Mon, 20 December 2004 20:29
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: icedog90 on Mon, 20 December 2004 20:33
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: SuperFlyingEngi on Mon, 20 December 2004 20:39
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: warranto on Mon, 20 December 2004 20:40
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cheesesoda on Mon, 20 December 2004 20:41
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: SuperFlyingEngi on Mon, 20 December 2004 20:42
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: DarkDemin on Mon, 20 December 2004 20:42
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: icedog90 on Mon, 20 December 2004 20:44
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cheesesoda on Mon, 20 December 2004 20:45
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: warranto on Mon, 20 December 2004 20:47
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: SuperFlyingEngi on Mon, 20 December 2004 20:48
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cheesesoda on Mon, 20 December 2004 20:48
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: warranto on Mon, 20 December 2004 20:52
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: xptek on Mon, 20 December 2004 21:07
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: NeoSaber on Mon, 20 December 2004 21:09
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: warranto on Mon, 20 December 2004 21:13
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Mon, 20 December 2004 21:20
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: SuperFlyingEngi on Tue, 21 December 2004 12:48
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Javaxcx on Tue, 21 December 2004 13:27
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: rm5248 on Tue, 21 December 2004 13:42
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cheesesoda on Tue, 21 December 2004 13:50
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: NeoSaber on Tue, 21 December 2004 14:11
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: glyde51 on Tue, 21 December 2004 14:12
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Crimson on Wed, 22 December 2004 00:43
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Wed, 22 December 2004 01:50
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: SuperFlyingEngi on Wed, 22 December 2004 07:35
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Wed, 22 December 2004 08:44
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Crimson on Wed, 22 December 2004 09:48
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: SuperFlyingEngi on Wed, 22 December 2004 09:55
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: SuperFlyingEngi on Wed, 22 December 2004 10:02
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: NeoSaber on Wed, 22 December 2004 11:29
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cheesesoda on Wed, 22 December 2004 15:15
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: DarkDemin on Wed, 22 December 2004 15:26
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jaspah on Wed, 22 December 2004 15:54
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Crimson on Thu, 23 December 2004 01:37
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Hydra on Thu, 23 December 2004 02:00
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Crimson on Thu, 23 December 2004 03:47
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Thu, 23 December 2004 06:14
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: warranto on Thu, 23 December 2004 07:34
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Javaxcx on Thu, 23 December 2004 07:38
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Thu, 23 December 2004 08:25
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Hydra on Thu, 23 December 2004 11:31
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Thu, 23 December 2004 12:37
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: xptek on Thu, 23 December 2004 13:12
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: warranto on Thu, 23 December 2004 16:09
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Thu, 23 December 2004 16:23
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: warranto on Thu, 23 December 2004 16:31
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Vitaminous on Thu, 23 December 2004 16:40
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Thu, 23 December 2004 16:48
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cowmisfit on Thu, 23 December 2004 17:48
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: SuperFlyingEngi on Thu, 23 December 2004 18:03
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cowmisfit on Thu, 23 December 2004 19:02
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Hydra on Thu, 23 December 2004 23:08
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Crimson on Fri, 24 December 2004 01:52
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: SuperFlyingEngi on Fri, 24 December 2004 06:42
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cowmisfit on Fri, 24 December 2004 07:15
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Fri, 24 December 2004 07:28
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: SuperFlyingEngi on Fri, 24 December 2004 12:07
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: xptek on Fri, 24 December 2004 12:27
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Javaxcx on Fri, 24 December 2004 13:05
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: xptek on Fri, 24 December 2004 15:16
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Crimson on Fri, 24 December 2004 16:36
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: NukeIt15 on Mon, 27 December 2004 17:32
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Hydra on Thu, 30 December 2004 04:16
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Javaxcx on Thu, 30 December 2004 10:40
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: warranto on Thu, 30 December 2004 11:45
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Javaxcx on Thu, 30 December 2004 12:07
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: warranto on Thu, 30 December 2004 13:02
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Javaxcx on Thu, 30 December 2004 13:10
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Deathgod on Thu, 30 December 2004 13:19
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: NukeIt15 on Thu, 30 December 2004 15:14
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Javaxcx on Thu, 30 December 2004 15:33
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Thu, 30 December 2004 18:09
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Javaxcx on Thu, 30 December 2004 18:51
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: warranto on Thu, 30 December 2004 21:38
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: glyde51 on Thu, 30 December 2004 21:40
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Javaxcx on Thu, 30 December 2004 21:51
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Spoony_old on Fri, 31 December 2004 06:58
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cowmisfit on Fri, 31 December 2004 08:15
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Fri, 31 December 2004 13:37
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Javaxcx on Fri, 31 December 2004 13:49
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Fabian on Fri, 31 December 2004 14:09
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Crimson on Fri, 31 December 2004 14:41
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Fabian on Fri, 31 December 2004 15:25
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Sat, 01 January 2005 11:19
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Javaxcx on Sat, 01 January 2005 12:11
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Spoony_old on Sat, 01 January 2005 12:16
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cowmisfit on Sat, 01 January 2005 13:21
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: warranto on Sat, 01 January 2005 14:04
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Spoony_old on Sat, 01 January 2005 15:08
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Javaxcx on Sat, 01 January 2005 15:23
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Spoony_old on Sat, 01 January 2005 19:00
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Javaxcx on Sat, 01 January 2005 19:57
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Spoony_old on Sat, 01 January 2005 20:06
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Sat, 01 January 2005 21:01
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Javaxcx on Sat, 01 January 2005 21:21
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Sat, 01 January 2005 22:41
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: msgtpain on Sat, 01 January 2005 22:47
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Javaxcx on Sat, 01 January 2005 22:54
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Sat, 01 January 2005 22:59
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Javaxcx on Sat, 01 January 2005 22:59
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Javaxcx on Sat, 01 January 2005 23:02
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Sat, 01 January 2005 23:10
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Javaxcx on Sat, 01 January 2005 23:16
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: ----- on Sat, 01 January 2005 23:38
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: U927 on Sat, 01 January 2005 23:41
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: ----- on Sat, 01 January 2005 23:44
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Spoony_old on Sun, 02 January 2005 06:00
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Sun, 02 January 2005 08:09
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cowmisfit on Sun, 02 January 2005 08:28
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Fabian on Sun, 02 January 2005 08:50
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Javaxcx on Sun, 02 January 2005 09:19
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Spoony_old on Sun, 02 January 2005 09:32
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Sun, 02 January 2005 11:08
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Javaxcx on Sun, 02 January 2005 11:26
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Sun, 02 January 2005 11:43
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Javaxcx on Sun, 02 January 2005 12:24
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: DaveGMM on Sun, 02 January 2005 12:50
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: warranto on Sun, 02 January 2005 13:58
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cowmisfit on Sun, 02 January 2005 14:06
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Spoony_old on Sun, 02 January 2005 14:21
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cowmisfit on Sun, 02 January 2005 14:32
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Javaxcx on Sun, 02 January 2005 14:33
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: warranto on Sun, 02 January 2005 14:41
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: DaveGMM on Sun, 02 January 2005 14:53
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Spoony_old on Sun, 02 January 2005 15:24
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cheesesoda on Sun, 02 January 2005 15:28
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cowmisfit on Sun, 02 January 2005 15:39
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: SuperFlyingEngi on Sun, 02 January 2005 15:42
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Spoony_old on Sun, 02 January 2005 15:43
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: warranto on Sun, 02 January 2005 15:51
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: U927 on Sun, 02 January 2005 15:53
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: warranto on Sun, 02 January 2005 15:58
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cowmisfit on Sun, 02 January 2005 16:08
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: SuperFlyingEngi on Sun, 02 January 2005 16:09
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: DaveGMM on Sun, 02 January 2005 16:11
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cowmisfit on Sun, 02 January 2005 16:15
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Sun, 02 January 2005 16:15
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cowmisfit on Sun, 02 January 2005 16:16
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: DaveGMM on Sun, 02 January 2005 16:24
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Sun, 02 January 2005 16:26
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Javaxcx on Sun, 02 January 2005 16:28
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: DaveGMM on Sun, 02 January 2005 16:29
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Sun, 02 January 2005 16:33
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: DaveGMM on Sun, 02 January 2005 16:34
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Sun, 02 January 2005 16:37
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Spoony_old on Sun, 02 January 2005 16:48
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: U927 on Sun, 02 January 2005 16:48
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Fabian on Sun, 02 January 2005 17:05
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: warranto on Sun, 02 January 2005 17:25
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Ryan3k on Sun, 02 January 2005 17:41
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Spoony_old on Sun, 02 January 2005 17:49
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: DaveGMM on Sun, 02 January 2005 17:49
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Sun, 02 January 2005 20:17
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Crimson on Sun, 02 January 2005 22:04
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Vitaminous on Sun, 02 January 2005 22:20
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Fabian on Sun, 02 January 2005 22:43
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Hydra on Sun, 02 January 2005 23:16
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Spoony_old on Mon, 03 January 2005 01:35
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Doitle on Mon, 03 January 2005 01:52
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Crimson on Mon, 03 January 2005 02:54
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cowmisfit on Mon, 03 January 2005 04:37
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Spoony_old on Mon, 03 January 2005 04:44
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cowmisfit on Mon, 03 January 2005 04:58
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Mon, 03 January 2005 05:29
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Spoony_old on Mon, 03 January 2005 06:00
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: DaveGMM on Mon, 03 January 2005 06:04
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Spoony_old on Mon, 03 January 2005 06:07
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Mon, 03 January 2005 07:14
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Spoony_old on Mon, 03 January 2005 09:07
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cheesesoda on Mon, 03 January 2005 09:19
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Spoony_old on Mon, 03 January 2005 10:04
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: DaveGMM on Mon, 03 January 2005 10:04
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cheesesoda on Mon, 03 January 2005 10:09
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: warranto on Mon, 03 January 2005 11:13
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cheesesoda on Mon, 03 January 2005 11:23
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: DaveGMM on Mon, 03 January 2005 11:23
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cheesesoda on Mon, 03 January 2005 11:26
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: DaveGMM on Mon, 03 January 2005 11:30
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cheesesoda on Mon, 03 January 2005 11:32
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Spoony_old on Mon, 03 January 2005 11:41
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cheesesoda on Mon, 03 January 2005 11:50
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Fabian on Mon, 03 January 2005 12:02
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cheesesoda on Mon, 03 January 2005 12:04
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Mon, 03 January 2005 12:11
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Spoony_old on Mon, 03 January 2005 12:15
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Fabian on Mon, 03 January 2005 12:19
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cheesesoda on Mon, 03 January 2005 12:25
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: warranto on Mon, 03 January 2005 12:27
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cheesesoda on Mon, 03 January 2005 12:32
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Fabian on Mon, 03 January 2005 12:35
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cheesesoda on Mon, 03 January 2005 12:39
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: warranto on Mon, 03 January 2005 12:40
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: warranto on Mon, 03 January 2005 12:42
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cheesesoda on Mon, 03 January 2005 12:43
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Fabian on Mon, 03 January 2005 12:46
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cowmisfit on Mon, 03 January 2005 13:39
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Vitaminous on Mon, 03 January 2005 14:23
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: warranto on Mon, 03 January 2005 14:59
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Spoony_old on Mon, 03 January 2005 16:34
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cowmisfit on Mon, 03 January 2005 16:49
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Crimson on Mon, 03 January 2005 17:03
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Spoony_old on Mon, 03 January 2005 17:08
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cowmisfit on Mon, 03 January 2005 17:19
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: DaveGMM on Mon, 03 January 2005 17:24
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Mon, 03 January 2005 17:37
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Spoony_old on Mon, 03 January 2005 17:42
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cowmisfit on Mon, 03 January 2005 18:26
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Mon, 03 January 2005 18:57
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cowmisfit on Mon, 03 January 2005 19:59
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: warranto on Mon, 03 January 2005 22:50
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Mon, 03 January 2005 23:50
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: DaveGMM on Tue, 04 January 2005 00:43
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Tue, 04 January 2005 01:01
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: DaveGMM on Tue, 04 January 2005 01:09
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: warranto on Tue, 04 January 2005 01:18
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cowmisfit on Tue, 04 January 2005 04:58
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Spoony_old on Tue, 04 January 2005 05:30
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Tue, 04 January 2005 08:01
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Spoony_old on Tue, 04 January 2005 08:18
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: warranto on Tue, 04 January 2005 12:03
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: DaveGMM on Tue, 04 January 2005 12:03
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cowmisfit on Tue, 04 January 2005 13:31
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Javaxcx on Tue, 04 January 2005 13:44
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: warranto on Tue, 04 January 2005 14:22
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Tue, 04 January 2005 14:34
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Javaxcx on Tue, 04 January 2005 14:40
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Spoony_old on Tue, 04 January 2005 14:53
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Tue, 04 January 2005 14:57
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: DaveGMM on Tue, 04 January 2005 15:03
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: DaveGMM on Tue, 04 January 2005 15:04
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Spoony_old on Tue, 04 January 2005 15:06
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Tue, 04 January 2005 15:07
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: DaveGMM on Tue, 04 January 2005 16:01
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Tue, 04 January 2005 16:45
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: DaveGMM on Tue, 04 January 2005 17:00
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Tue, 04 January 2005 17:17
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cowmisfit on Tue, 04 January 2005 17:49
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: warranto on Tue, 04 January 2005 18:16
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: splnwezel on Tue, 04 January 2005 20:51
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Fabian on Tue, 04 January 2005 21:13
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Hydra on Tue, 04 January 2005 22:01
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Javaxcx on Wed, 05 January 2005 13:28
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Hydra on Wed, 05 January 2005 14:35
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Fabian on Wed, 05 January 2005 15:52
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Wed, 05 January 2005 17:58
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Javaxcx on Wed, 05 January 2005 18:41
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Wed, 05 January 2005 18:58
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Javaxcx on Wed, 05 January 2005 19:21
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Wed, 05 January 2005 20:42
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Javaxcx on Wed, 05 January 2005 21:02
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Doitle on Wed, 05 January 2005 22:08
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Crimson on Thu, 06 January 2005 15:44
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Fabian on Thu, 06 January 2005 15:52
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Aircraftkiller on Thu, 06 January 2005 17:02
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Fabian on Thu, 06 January 2005 17:05
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Thu, 06 January 2005 18:12
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Fabian on Thu, 06 January 2005 18:46
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Fri, 07 January 2005 01:50
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Fabian on Fri, 07 January 2005 14:22
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Cassie on Fri, 07 January 2005 17:09
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Aircraftkiller on Sat, 08 January 2005 02:01
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Aircraftkiller on Sat, 08 January 2005 02:04
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Crimson on Sat, 08 January 2005 03:38
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Fabian on Sat, 08 January 2005 06:29
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: SuperFlyingEngi on Sat, 08 January 2005 09:29
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Cassie on Sat, 08 January 2005 19:31
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Hydra on Sat, 08 January 2005 23:52
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Sat, 08 January 2005 23:53
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: prox on Sun, 09 January 2005 08:18
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Fabian on Sun, 09 January 2005 12:19
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Sun, 09 January 2005 19:26
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Fabian on Sun, 09 January 2005 20:06
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Nodbugger on Sun, 09 January 2005 21:47
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: cheesesoda on Sun, 09 January 2005 22:03
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Mon, 10 January 2005 03:47
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Spoony_old on Mon, 10 January 2005 05:01
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Mon, 10 January 2005 10:29
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Spoony_old on Mon, 10 January 2005 10:33
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Fabian on Mon, 10 January 2005 15:01
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Jecht on Mon, 10 January 2005 19:40
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: glyde51 on Mon, 10 January 2005 19:43
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Fabian on Mon, 10 January 2005 20:23
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Hydra on Wed, 12 January 2005 09:38
		As if we could pretend this wouldn't come around... By: Fabian on Thu, 13 January 2005 19:27

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