Home » Tiberian Technologies / Blackhand Studios » Other Products » Unit Balance
|
|
| Unit Balance [message #83385] |
Mon, 26 April 2004 01:04   |
 |
Aircraftkiller
Messages: 8213
Registered: February 2003
Karma: 0
|
General (5 Stars) |
|
|
| Deathgod |
Shit, Grenadiers already HAVE a useful, damaging weapon. They fuck up vehicles and buildings hardcore, and they are FREE. They can kill a building by themselves, for god's sake.
|
And any soldier kills them without a problem. Because they're meant to be anti-infantry and anti-structure, but they aren't. They're simply fucked up weapons that have little use. Rarely can a Grenadier ever destroy a building by themselves, or any other free unit. MOst of them shouldn't be free to begin with.
| Quote: |
And last time I checked, in EVERY C&C GAME the artillery units are lightly armored. They're not meant to be used in a firefight. This can be negated in Ren to a large extent through skillful driving and engineer support.
|
Yeah, and in every C&C game, they didn't get destroyed in five seconds by a sniper all the way across a level.
| Quote: |
Are you going to take out the engineers' ability to repair vehicles and players too? That wasn't in C&C. :rolleyes:
|
We should, but since TD didn't have a repair ability for vehicles beyond Repair Facilities, I can't really say "change that."
| Quote: |
Wait, you probably will, since all your ideas so far turn it from Renegade into ACKgade which is strikingly similar to RenAlert. If these issues are so problematic, and you fixed them all in RenAlert, then why not just play it?
|
No, it's strikingly similar to C&C. Perhaps you enjoy Homogade, that's your perogative. It isn't mine or the opinion of many others. I want to play C&C1 in first person, I don't want a bastardized version of it. How many times do I have to tell you that?
| Quote: |
I still don't get what your beef with the 1000-cred snipers is. Change their point scale so they don't get as much for shooting armor, as it's a bug, and leave the rest intact. It takes an aircraft 4-5 machine gun shots to kill a Havoc or Sakura, in the same time that the sniper can get ONE shot off. If you're getting that torn up by snipers I honestly feel it's a case of user error. I've also never had a huge problem killing them with regular soldiers, and even if you do die, they get 2 points. WOW GAMEBRAKINN FUKEN HAXX.
|
Man, you must not be playing the same game I am, because it only takes five shots from a n00b cannon to kill an Orca. No accuracy penalty. No round times. No nothing except "point, click, Orca is dead."
How fucking balanced is that? ANYTHING CAN BE COUNTERED IF YOU CAN GET NEAR IT.. BIG FUCKING WHOOP! I swear you'd be defending a unit if it were in Renegade for two years, and it destroyed everything in one button press that took ten seconds to charge... Yeah, you can stop that from happening, but it isn't very fucking realistic to imagine it happening.
n00b cannons aren't that overbalanced, but they're pretty damn close with the way they fuck up the game. Why attack with tanks, they just shoot them to get points and negate the damage you do to buildings... Why attack with soldiers? They just kill you in a few seconds from across the level.
Yeah, you don't have a problem... I'm sure you won't after being killed over 10 times trying to kill a Havoc with a rifle soldier.
|
|
|
|
| Unit Balance [message #83403] |
Mon, 26 April 2004 05:22 |
 |
Blazer
Messages: 3322
Registered: February 2003
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Karma: 0
|
General (3 Stars)
Administrator/General |
|
|
| Deathgod |
now that you've given us a way to play cheat-free again, you're in essence asking us to not play the game we wanted to be playing but a new game that is similar yet different in many basic ways, and in my opinion not as fun.
|
Bear in mind the reason I created this forum was so everyone can talk and discuss not only bugfixes but possible enhancments. This is just the discussion stage, and while of course Aircraftkiller is very passionate about the way he thinks things should be, nothing has been decided, and this isn't a "this is how things are going to be" discussion.
Personally I think that if Blackhand Studios does any substantial modifications to Renegade besides basic bugfixes, that we should create an alternate game, and call it something like RenegadeX or something. So that people can still play the origional game with its wacky environment that they like, and those who want to play the "new and improved" Renegade can click a different icon and play on RenegadeX servers.
|
|
|
|
| Unit Balance [message #83405] |
Mon, 26 April 2004 05:33 |
|
|
If/when we do implement new preset changes, they wont be global.
They will only be on new Blackhand Studios maps (which might be modified versnios of existing maps, westwood, ACK or otherwise or might be totally new)
Jonathan Wilson aka Jonwil
Creator and Lead Coder of the Custom scripts.dll
Renegade Engine Guru
Creator and Lead Coder of TT.DLL
Official member of Tiberian Technologies
|
|
|
|
| Unit Balance [message #83415] |
Mon, 26 April 2004 07:15 |
Homey
Messages: 1084
Registered: February 2003
Location: Canada
Karma: 0
|
General (1 Star) |
|
|
About the host
It doesn't matter if they flicker or not its still hard to hit, if it wasn't the host would never miss, yet they do. the pistol, you should have it loaded anyways
Homey
|
|
|
|
| Unit Balance [message #83435] |
Mon, 26 April 2004 08:36 |
 |
Deathgod
Messages: 504
Registered: February 2003
Location: The House of B
Karma: 0
|
Colonel |
|
|
See, ACK never mentioned that these will be on specific maps. He was making it sound like anyone who owned Renguard and opted for patches was going to wake up one day with a different game. I think the map plan is by far a better idea, though. That will mean old maps and the new, 'fixed' maps could be in rotation at the same time, which would be pretty cool. Thanks for the clarification, Blazer and jonwil.
ACK, man, honestly I think you take everything I say as a personal attack. I'm not intending that. If I was I'd come in here and just say "ACK IS AN ASSRAMMING HOMOFAG MASCOT" or something. I'm not here to try to insult you, I appreciate your work ethic in getting these bugs and shit taken care of. I just feel that a lot of you are overdramatizing the fucking Ramjet. It's one gun. I don't see anyone complaining about the fact that Sydney does 5 more damage at the MCT than Raveshaw does, or that GDI soldiers do 40% more damage than Nod ones do, which is really broken early game. If the gun itself is the problem, then fix the bugs which give it extra points against heavy armor and be done with it. I think they should be able to kill free soldiers in one shot; if Rav and Sydney can, why shouldn't they? Are Rav and Sydney broke too? What about Mobius/Mendoza? They eat everything just like Rav/Sydney do.
And I'm sorry, not only have I never been horribly destroyed by a Havoc/Sakura when all I get is a free solider, but I rarely get taken down by Ramjet fire when I'm in an Orca because I put 5 slugs into that person's face right after I see the first shot and they die before they get enough shots off to kill me. If you fly into an area where you KNOW there are a lot of snipers with an aircraft, that's not a broken game, that's poor strategy. Would you be complaining if it was 5 Raveshaws who dropped you in one shot?
WOL: priestofb
FUD Online for Renegade character details
The preceding post was sponsored by FUD.
We are the way, you are in the way.â„¢
|
|
|
|
| Unit Balance [message #83437] |
Mon, 26 April 2004 09:06 |
Homey
Messages: 1084
Registered: February 2003
Location: Canada
Karma: 0
|
General (1 Star) |
|
|
| Blazer |
| Deathgod |
now that you've given us a way to play cheat-free again, you're in essence asking us to not play the game we wanted to be playing but a new game that is similar yet different in many basic ways, and in my opinion not as fun.
|
Bear in mind the reason I created this forum was so everyone can talk and discuss not only bugfixes but possible enhancments. This is just the discussion stage, and while of course Aircraftkiller is very passionate about the way he thinks things should be, nothing has been decided, and this isn't a "this is how things are going to be" discussion.
Personally I think that if Blackhand Studios does any substantial modifications to Renegade besides basic bugfixes, that we should create an alternate game, and call it something like RenegadeX or something. So that people can still play the origional game with its wacky environment that they like, and those who want to play the "new and improved" Renegade can click a different icon and play on RenegadeX servers.
|
I agree, all these balance changes should be a modification or something. I doubt half of the people who play now want it changes.
Homey
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Unit Balance [message #83484] |
Mon, 26 April 2004 11:13 |
Homey
Messages: 1084
Registered: February 2003
Location: Canada
Karma: 0
|
General (1 Star) |
|
|
Nod shooters have way bigger heads then gdi
Homey
|
|
|
|
| Unit Balance [message #83488] |
Mon, 26 April 2004 11:35 |
DarkFish
Messages: 49
Registered: January 2004
Location: London, Uk
Karma: 0
|
Recruit |
|
|
I don't see the need to go so far. Sure, just upgrade the mammoth a little to make it useful, decrease sniper damage to Helicopters and Artilleries/MRLSs. Fix a few bugs, and major balance issues, then leave it at that.
Of course, you can make a more extreme "True C&C" map pack if you want, but I for one would like to see just smaller changes on their own, as I feel these would improve the gameplay more for me.
Remember that Ack is not trying to force these down your throats. I'm sure there are others who want to play a "True C&C" Renegade mod, and this would be an option available to them.
The Dark Angels
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Unit Balance [message #83542] |
Mon, 26 April 2004 15:09 |
flyingfox
Messages: 1612
Registered: February 2003
Location: scotland, uk
Karma: 0
|
General (1 Star) |
|
|
| Aircraftkiller |
Get the point? I'm not saying anything but having the core gameplay.
|
I take the point. Although I think what you're trying to say is in one way or another what I was too. "Change what can be changed, keep the focus on gameplay, keep it fun while making it as accurate as possible to C&C."
~g
|
|
|
|
| Unit Balance [message #84288] |
Thu, 29 April 2004 19:28 |
EnGiMaN56
Messages: 10
Registered: April 2004
Karma: 0
|
Recruit |
|
|
|
Ok, its a 1v1, walls_flying im gdi, enemy buys a light tank, i come over in my orca and shoot him down 50% or w/e it was, i go back to reload, he repairs way quicker with technition and gets closer to my base, i go him him down from full health again to half health, and he hops out repairs again while im refilling, nice cycle there light tank wins . I know you guys say that renegade is meant for 7v7+ but reloading of orca/apache is just lame, Tanks dont have to.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Unit Balance [message #84323] |
Fri, 30 April 2004 00:59 |
EnGiMaN56
Messages: 10
Registered: April 2004
Karma: 0
|
Recruit |
|
|
|
ACKgade .... rofl , you're to newb to realise how good the orca is? if you could aim too it owns ramjet.
|
|
|
|
| Unit Balance [message #84357] |
Fri, 30 April 2004 08:20 |
Slash0x
Messages: 455
Registered: January 2004
Location: California
Karma: 0
|
Commander |
|
|
Kill the healer if he jumps out of the Light tank, not that hard, then steal his light and destroy your orca, bam! Fun fun...doh!!!
>.<
L3T'5 4LL THR0W 3GG5 4T D4 N00B! 
|
|
|
|
| Unit Balance [message #84380] |
Fri, 30 April 2004 09:57 |
spoonyrat
Messages: 406
Registered: December 2003
Location: England
Karma: 0
|
Commander |
|
|
|
Like I keep saying.... downgrading orca/apache or changing its armour system will wreck small games... But since ACK doesn't like small games, obviously that's irrelevant :rolleyes: . Let's ignore the fact that a massive part of the gaming community PREFERS small games, because they're not ACK and as such, don't matter
|
|
|
|
| Unit Balance [message #84388] |
Fri, 30 April 2004 11:20 |
|
Aircraftkiller
Messages: 8213
Registered: February 2003
Karma: 0
|
General (5 Stars) |
|
|
Yeah, that's why the majority of players are found on the larger 16-128 player servers.
| Quote: |
ACKgade .... rofl , you're to newb to realise how good the orca is? if you could aim too it owns ramjet.
|
I'm a newbie? I hate to break it to you but I've been playing this game since 3 December of 2001, and beta tested the game AND the flying units before people like you had a chance to play with them.
They don't easily own any "sniper" units. If you can keep a bead on a "sniper," sure, but that's pretty damn hard when they're in scope mode and flicker around making it imposible to get a good shot on them. Try and land on them and they move out of the way, by which time their other n00b cannon friend has already shot you down, and you're dead.
It's even worse if you just leave your base, they camp on the bridge or at their own base, and flying out gets you destroyed in a few seconds.
Pretty fucking lame to have units that are almost worthless. Why even bother to purchase an aircraft if their only use is to give massive points to the enemy team and not even be able to do much?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Pages (14): [ 4 ] |
  |
Goto Forum:
Current Time: Mon Nov 11 03:43:40 MST 2024
Total time taken to generate the page: 0.01945 seconds
|
Search
Help
Members
Register
Login
Home
