Home » General Discussions » Heated Discussions and Debates » history lesson
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| Re: history lesson [message #267207 is a reply to message #267175] |
Tue, 19 June 2007 01:35   |
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futura83
Messages: 1285
Registered: July 2006
Location: England
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General (1 Star)
Viva la Resistance! |
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Ofcourse that won't happen if they note how the writers of this program only get shit as return of the "community"
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We all know how long it took them to get the last patch out...and it called for brenbot to be updatedd... 
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| Re: history lesson [message #267209 is a reply to message #267208] |
Tue, 19 June 2007 01:38 |
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futura83
Messages: 1285
Registered: July 2006
Location: England
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General (1 Star)
Viva la Resistance! |
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| CarrierII wrote on Tue, 19 June 2007 09:37 |
Anyone can stand there and say
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Renguard is useless and we need something better
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But only a few people can actually make it. So, until you have a BETTER FUCKING ANTICHEAT SOLUTION, SHUT THE FUCK UP.
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Yes cos you really expect everyone to not complain about it 
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| Re: history lesson [message #267212 is a reply to message #267064] |
Tue, 19 June 2007 01:55 |
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Crimson
Messages: 7429
Registered: February 2003
Location: Phoenix, AZ
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General (5 Stars)
ADMINISTRATOR |
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First off, this obviously has to be moved to the Hot Issues forum...
OK, so I dug out the presentation that I put together for EA about BHS and I can give you a little more detail on the history now.
Renegade was virtually cheat-free from its release on February 26, 2002 until late summer of 2003. Then, it became impossible to deny as grief players came into games and were impossibly good at killing people.
I don't remember exactly how it all happened or who started it (I think it was mac), but a group of people who was comprised of community leaders, talented coders, and even an ex-Westwood employee got together and decided to form a team to create an anti-cheat solution. Some of the original members of this unnamed group, if memory serves, were Blazer and I, mac, Olaf van der Spek, Greg Underwood (ex-Westwood employee) and Dante.
So, at that time, I prepared a statement for the community about the status of cheats and what we were going to do about them. In addition to starting work on RenGuard, we also decided to start a private "Server Owners" forum here at RenegadeForums.com, and invited all server owners to gather there and share proof, nicknames, and IPs of cheaters with each other. It was highly effective... a cheater could go into one server and within 24 hours, he was banned from all of the most popular servers in the community.
Amid internal squabbles, loss of coders, and other delays, we managed to get a public beta test started near middle/late March 2004. We had a pretty good turnout with about 120 users participating. We released RenGuard 1.0 in Mid-April, 2004. Of course, even with all that testing, there were still come bugs to clean up, and we had a few patches until May 14, 2004, when version 1.03 went live and it was effective with only server-side updates to counter new cheats for quite a while.
We also used RenGuard as a primary delivery mechanism for Core Patch 1 (on November 30, 2004) and Core Patch 2 (on February 23, 2006). We are now working on Core Patch 3 which is nowhere near done or feature-locked. 
I'm the bawss.
[Updated on: Tue, 19 June 2007 01:55] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: history lesson [message #267213 is a reply to message #267064] |
Tue, 19 June 2007 01:55 |
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futura83
Messages: 1285
Registered: July 2006
Location: England
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General (1 Star)
Viva la Resistance! |
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I don't even know most of them!
This isn't about the coders, it's about the product...BTW, carrier, next time you see people moaning about EA fucking up games, i suppose you'll be telling them to STFU unless they prove they can make better - correct?
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| Re: history lesson [message #267215 is a reply to message #267064] |
Tue, 19 June 2007 02:00 |
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futura83
Messages: 1285
Registered: July 2006
Location: England
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General (1 Star)
Viva la Resistance! |
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oh...i forgot to mention:
Where did i say RG is 100% useless and should be scrapped?
RG is good by the way it stops alot of cheats, but like has been said, on alot of servers, good players are harrassed if they aren't running RG, and some n00b players will forcerg them because of it.
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| Re: history lesson [message #267219 is a reply to message #267217] |
Tue, 19 June 2007 02:06 |
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futura83
Messages: 1285
Registered: July 2006
Location: England
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General (1 Star)
Viva la Resistance! |
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| Jecht wrote on Tue, 19 June 2007 10:04 |
Whenever I want to avoid a forcerg, I run Renguard...
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But why should people have to download RG just to avoid n00bs thinking that they cheat?
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| Re: history lesson [message #267220 is a reply to message #267064] |
Tue, 19 June 2007 02:06 |
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Crimson
Messages: 7429
Registered: February 2003
Location: Phoenix, AZ
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General (5 Stars)
ADMINISTRATOR |
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I changed n00bstories (a long time ago) to require 5 people to forcerg instead of the default of 3. I also removed the annoyance reminder except when you first join. It works pretty well for us.
I'm the bawss.
[Updated on: Tue, 19 June 2007 02:06] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: history lesson [message #267221 is a reply to message #267220] |
Tue, 19 June 2007 02:12 |
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futura83
Messages: 1285
Registered: July 2006
Location: England
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General (1 Star)
Viva la Resistance! |
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| Crimson wrote on Tue, 19 June 2007 10:06 |
I changed n00bstories (a long time ago) to require 5 people to forcerg instead of the default of 3. I also removed the annoyance reminder except when you first join. It works pretty well for us.
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It's a shame other servers havnt followed.
I know some servers that only allow you to use 'basic' commands if you aren't running RG...
This is a signature. Reading this is wasting your time.
[Updated on: Tue, 19 June 2007 02:13] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: history lesson [message #267226 is a reply to message #267221] |
Tue, 19 June 2007 02:51 |
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Goztow
Messages: 9737
Registered: March 2005
Location: Belgium
Karma: 13
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General (5 Stars)
Goztoe |
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| Ancient_and_forever wrote on Tue, 19 June 2007 11:12 |
| Crimson wrote on Tue, 19 June 2007 10:06 |
I changed n00bstories (a long time ago) to require 5 people to forcerg instead of the default of 3. I also removed the annoyance reminder except when you first join. It works pretty well for us.
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It's a shame other servers havnt followed.
I know some servers that only allow you to use 'basic' commands if you aren't running RG...
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Don't you feel stupid for playing on those other servers? I know at least TheKOSs2-server has followed this a long time ago, as I configured it this way...
You can find me in The KOSs2 (TK2) discord while I'm playing. Feel free to come and say hi! TK2 discord
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| Re: history lesson [message #267229 is a reply to message #267226] |
Tue, 19 June 2007 02:54 |
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futura83
Messages: 1285
Registered: July 2006
Location: England
Karma: 0
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General (1 Star)
Viva la Resistance! |
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| Goztow wrote on Tue, 19 June 2007 10:51 |
| Ancient_and_forever wrote on Tue, 19 June 2007 11:12 |
| Crimson wrote on Tue, 19 June 2007 10:06 |
I changed n00bstories (a long time ago) to require 5 people to forcerg instead of the default of 3. I also removed the annoyance reminder except when you first join. It works pretty well for us.
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It's a shame other servers havnt followed.
I know some servers that only allow you to use 'basic' commands if you aren't running RG...
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Don't you feel stupid for playing on those other servers? I know at least TheKOSs2-server has followed this a long time ago, as I configured it this way...
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No, i don't feel stupid for playing on them.
Why? Because the one i particular i go on is MP-Gaming which is one of the best DM servers...
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| Re: history lesson [message #267233 is a reply to message #267064] |
Tue, 19 June 2007 03:16 |
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Crimson
Messages: 7429
Registered: February 2003
Location: Phoenix, AZ
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General (5 Stars)
ADMINISTRATOR |
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Yeah, I also only disable the "!showmods" command for non-RG users since it's commonly what a cheater will do before "unloading" on the players in-game. We have really good moderator coverage anyway, so it's not very common that players in-game will actually catch a cheater before a mod does.
I'm the bawss.
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| Re: history lesson [message #267242 is a reply to message #267203] |
Tue, 19 June 2007 04:21 |
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Spoony
Messages: 3915
Registered: January 2006
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General (3 Stars)
Tactics & Strategies Moderator |
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people who say BIATCH is all you need are wrong
people who say renguard is all you need are wrong
people who say good moderators are all you need are wrong
none of the above are infallible, all of the above can do stuff others can't, so the solution is obvious: use all three.
or if you can genuinely make something better, quit telling everyone you can, step up and fucking DO IT.
Unleash the Renerageâ„¢
Renedrama [ren-i-drah-muh]
- noun
1. the inevitable criticism one receives after doing something awful
[Updated on: Tue, 19 June 2007 04:23] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: history lesson [message #267255 is a reply to message #267242] |
Tue, 19 June 2007 06:32 |
StealthEye
Messages: 2518
Registered: May 2006
Location: The Netherlands
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General (2 Stars) |
 
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| Spoony. wrote on Tue, 19 June 2007 13:21 |
people who say BIATCH is all you need are wrong
people who say renguard is all you need are wrong
people who say good moderators are all you need are wrong
none of the above are infallible, all of the above can do stuff others can't, so the solution is obvious: use all three.
or if you can genuinely make something better, quit telling everyone you can, step up and fucking DO IT.
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QFT
!forcerg abuse is a server issue, you can't blame it on renguard.
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But why should people have to download RG just to avoid n00bs thinking that they cheat?
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If they don't, how would renguard be effective at all?
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This isn't about the coders, it's about the product...BTW, carrier, next time you see people moaning about EA fucking up games, i suppose you'll be telling them to STFU unless they prove they can make better - correct?
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That's correct. You can only say EA sucks if you compare it to other companies. However you can never actually demand EA to do it differently, nor can you say RG should change something. If you don't like it, don't use it. If you don't like EA, don't buy their games.
You don't go to EA's helpdesk shouting "hey, I haven't bought your games, but I think you suck and you should do ...". What difference is there that you can't do that to EA, but that you can do that to the RG team?
BlackIntel admin/founder/coder
Please visit http://www.blackintel.org/
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| Re: history lesson [message #267330 is a reply to message #267255] |
Tue, 19 June 2007 12:53 |
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EvilWhiteDragon
Messages: 3751
Registered: October 2005
Location: The Netherlands
Karma: 0
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General (3 Stars) |
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| StealthEye wrote on Tue, 19 June 2007 15:32 |
| Spoony. wrote on Tue, 19 June 2007 13:21 |
people who say BIATCH is all you need are wrong
people who say renguard is all you need are wrong
people who say good moderators are all you need are wrong
none of the above are infallible, all of the above can do stuff others can't, so the solution is obvious: use all three.
or if you can genuinely make something better, quit telling everyone you can, step up and fucking DO IT.
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QFT
!forcerg abuse is a server issue, you can't blame it on renguard.
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But why should people have to download RG just to avoid n00bs thinking that they cheat?
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If they don't, how would renguard be effective at all?
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This isn't about the coders, it's about the product...BTW, carrier, next time you see people moaning about EA fucking up games, i suppose you'll be telling them to STFU unless they prove they can make better - correct?
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That's correct. You can only say EA sucks if you compare it to other companies. However you can never actually demand EA to do it differently, nor can you say RG should change something. If you don't like it, don't use it. If you don't like EA, don't buy their games.
You don't go to EA's helpdesk shouting "hey, I haven't bought your games, but I think you suck and you should do ...". What difference is there that you can't do that to EA, but that you can do that to the RG team?
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One slight difference, with EA you could theworetically demand a good product, as you paid for it.
With RG you should be happy that it excists, as it is all made my normal ppl in their spare time, and they dont even get a single penny off it.
Hell, crimson even has to pay a lot to keep the RG master server up.
BlackIntel admin/founder/PR dude (not a coder)
Please visit http://www.blackintel.org/
| V, V for Vendetta |
People should not be afraid of their governments.
Governments should be afraid of their people.
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| Re: history lesson [message #267443 is a reply to message #267064] |
Tue, 19 June 2007 21:11 |
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Canadacdn
Messages: 1830
Registered: September 2005
Location: Temple of Nod
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General (1 Star)
PLECOS MASTER |
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Why has it become popular to rip on Renguard so much this past month? Is everyone trying to be like the cool rebellious kid in the schoolyard?
Renguard is a good anti-cheat solution that probably stops 90% of cheaters , random idiots who would download a cheat and use it for fun. It stops most idiot hackers and they simply give up, or just get perma-banned.
The remaining cheaters (which you see less and less of nowadays because of fine programs like Renguard and BIATCH) are simply cheating because they are huge faggots intent on ruining a game that people have enjoyed for years, and that have nothing better to do in their pathetic lives than laugh and get a hard on as he blows up a harvester with his damage mod.
/rant
[Updated on: Tue, 19 June 2007 21:13] Report message to a moderator |
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