Home » General Discussions » Heated Discussions and Debates » Religious Zealot forces airport to take down Christmas Trees
| Religious Zealot forces airport to take down Christmas Trees [message #233567] |
Sat, 09 December 2006 20:40  |
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Blazer
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Summary: The seatle airport has put up Christmas trees for the past 10 years. This year, some fuckhole threatened to sue them because the trees didn't represent his religion.
Apparently he would have been satisfied if they allowed him to put up an 8 foot menorah (I doubt he really wanted this and he was most likey being sarcastic). So he gave them a deadline of 2 days to meet his demands, or else he would sue. The airport didn't have time to deal with him so they complied and took down the decorations.
I have no problem with freedom of religion, and yeah I can obviously see that Christmas trees do not represent his religion, but what the fuck are they supposed to do? Reserve half of the aiport space so they can put up Menorahs, Buddahs, and the like to make sure they cover every religion so that someone won't sue them?
I think its sad that they were forced to undecorate the airport just to avoid being sued. Would it be so bad if the airport were able to say basically, "too bad if you don't like it, these decorations have been put up every year and they aren't bothering anyone but you so fuck off"? Come on, do you believe this guy was actually offended by Christmas trees...more likely he just raised a stink because he wanted attention...otherwise he would be doing the same thing to every department store and mall in the area as well.
| news story |
SEA-TAC Airport - All of the Christmas trees inside the terminal at Sea-Tac have been removed in response to a complaint by a rabbi.
A local rabbi wanted to install an 8-foot menorah and have a public lighting ceremony. He threatened to sue if the menorah wasn’t put up, and gave a two-day deadline to remove the trees...
The same decorations have been put up for at least 10 years...
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The full story is at http://www.king5.com/localnews/stories/NW_120906WABxmastreesEL.11b0d0cc.html#
[Updated on: Sun, 10 December 2006 14:34] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Religious Zealot forces airport take down Christmas Trees [message #233576 is a reply to message #233567] |
Sat, 09 December 2006 21:33  |
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NukeIt15
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I would note, for the record, that I am not Christian... and the fact that my family puts up a Christmas tree every year doesn't bother me in the slightest. It's fun to decorate, the holiday provides a wonderful and happy occasion for the whole family to gather- which doesn't happen the rest of the year- and it's tradition. I know predominantly Jewish and Wiccan folks who decorate for Christmas- how do you explain that away? As far as culture in this country goes, Christmas is no longer just a religious occasion. Anyone who cares to argue that point can go ahead and take a trip to any major city and check out the decorations that go up after Thanksgiving- and I don't just mean in stores. My stated opinion is that if it weren't Christmas, then it would be some other holiday- call it commercialization, call it culture, call it whatever you want, but every season has a mainstream holiday that the vast majority of people will recognize even if they don't celebrate it.
I'll never understand why people have to destroy one tradition in order to promote another. If it makes people happy to celebrate a holiday, and if the celebration of that holiday does no one any harm, it isn't and cannot be a bad thing.
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| Re: Religious Zealot forces airport take down Christmas Trees [message #233580 is a reply to message #233567] |
Sat, 09 December 2006 21:49 |
fl00d3d
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Location: Iowa, USA
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People will do anything for attention.
Sidenote: To the best of my knowledge, "trees" (Christmas trees) have absolutely no religious value whatsoever. So what was the argument? To me the trees seem like a seasonal tradition - not a religious celebration.
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| Re: Religious Zealot forces airport take down Christmas Trees [message #233612 is a reply to message #233610] |
Sun, 10 December 2006 05:07 |
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Sniper_De7
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| puddle_splasher wrote on Sun, 10 December 2006 05:41 |
| fl00d3d wrote on Sat, 09 December 2006 23:49 |
People will do anything for attention.
Sidenote: To the best of my knowledge, "trees" (Christmas trees) have absolutely no religious value whatsoever. So what was the argument? To me the trees seem like a seasonal tradition - not a religious celebration.
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Oderint, dum metuant.
It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat. - Theodore "Teddy" Roosevelt
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| Re: Religious Zealot forces airport take down Christmas Trees [message #233626 is a reply to message #233567] |
Sun, 10 December 2006 07:31 |
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SlikRik
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Welcome to the world, full of idiots with wrinkly nutsacs and saggy tits who try and be attention whores by spoiling the world for everyone. What a faggot...
Now the Jews have a lot of laws within their religion, some kinda useful, some (imo) just kinda stupid, but there is no where in the Jewish religion saying it is against their law to look at, or be in a room with, or stand next to, or have any kind of interaction with symbols of other religions. So the guy who threatened to sue the airport has almost no argument. It's not against his religion, he might not like it, but that's too bad for him, go use another airport then.
If you wanna take it a step further, a Christmas tree is barely a sign of Christianity. Sure it's a sign of Christmas, but the commercialized version, not the true spirit of the Christian Christmas. Well sorry for not representing every other holiday, but if he would get his head out of your ass once in a while you'd realize Christmas trees are symbols of the holidays in general. I have some Buddhist friends who celebrate Christmas!!
I think people need to stop giving in to these attention whores just cuz they don't wanna deal with them. They should go to court with this guy just to shut him up. What would his case be? "Oh, well I don't like them." So? Go sit in a corner pisshead and stare at the wall so 1, you won't have to look at the Christmas trees, and 2, so you won't bother any of us normal people.
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| Canadacdn wrote on Wed, 02 July 2008 15:52 |
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[Updated on: Sun, 10 December 2006 07:34] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Religious Zealot forces airport to take down Christmas Trees [message #233692 is a reply to message #233567] |
Sun, 10 December 2006 16:20 |
fl00d3d
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So you tell me where in the Bible it says that Christmas trees have absolutely ANY value? Its a man made tradition that is synonymous with Christmas because of traditions. But it has absolutely no value religiously. Which was the entire point of what I said. You simply misread it.
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| Re: Religious Zealot forces airport take down Christmas Trees [message #233734 is a reply to message #233610] |
Sun, 10 December 2006 22:51 |
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GoArmy44
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| puddle_splasher wrote on Sun, 10 December 2006 05:41 |
| fl00d3d wrote on Sat, 09 December 2006 23:49 |
People will do anything for attention.
Sidenote: To the best of my knowledge, "trees" (Christmas trees) have absolutely no religious value whatsoever. So what was the argument? To me the trees seem like a seasonal tradition - not a religious celebration.
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For fucksake take a reality check??
What is Christmas all about? Does Christianity mean something, anything to you, anything at all?
But then again when you make the above statement you must be the seasonal half-wit, but thats an insult to the half-wit.
Google Christmas tree + tradition. See what it shows. 
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I see you are still up to your "Google this and that" strategy...anyway dude he was just stating his opinion, no need to call him a "seasonal half-wit" because you disagree. Christmas trees have as much to do with Christmas as does the Easter bunny with Easter. Yes they are part of the tradition but the religious value is somewhat unimportant. You can burn the trees, throw away the expensive presents, and turn off the pretty lights but that still does not stop the true meaning of why some still celebrate Christmas: the birth of Jesus Christ. In my opinion the airport should have left the trees up there but it also made me wonder, how many of those trees actually had Christian symbols on them?
Reconcilia Rem Publicam!
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| Re: Religious Zealot forces airport to take down Christmas Trees [message #233746 is a reply to message #233692] |
Mon, 11 December 2006 04:21 |
puddle_splasher
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| fl00d3d wrote on Sun, 10 December 2006 17:20 |
So you tell me where in the Bible it says that Christmas trees have absolutely ANY value? Its a man made tradition that is synonymous with Christmas because of traditions. But it has absolutely no value religiously. Which was the entire point of what I said. You simply misread it.
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Flood, its always the bible with you. The bible this the bible that. Why is that?
Almost every topic that gets opened, you manage to get the bible into it, why?
It does not matter wether the topic warrants a biblical mention or not, you still manage it. What about all other Religious books or dont you acknowledge them and their religions? Are you so narrow minded that the Bible is the be all and end all?
Ive said to you before, the bible is a story based around a specific person, in a specific time,in a specific place, by specific people, for a specific purpose.
Back to Christmas Trees. If Christians want a Christmas tree then who the F*ck are others to worry about it. If you dont like it then dont look at the tree. Better still keep those people in their houses for the whole of festive period.
This is edited for ARMY GO!!
The baubles, candles, angel and star, all have Christian conortations. A Christmas tree without those additions is simply a fir tree. Therefore I would be very surprised if the tree had none of the above.
Oh look what google gives. Oh no its not the bible so it must be wrong.
The Legend of the First Christmas Tree
The night of the Saviour's birth, all the living creatures, both flora and fauna, came to Bethlehem with gifts. The olive tree brought its fruit and the palm its dates. But the little fir tree had no gift and was so tired it couldn't resist when the big trees pushed it into the background and hid it from view. But then a nearby angel took pity and commanded a cluster of stars to come and rest on its delicate boughs. When the Baby Jesus beheld this lovely lighted tree, He smiled and blessed it, declaring henceforth that fir trees should always be filled with lights at Christmastime to please little children.
[Updated on: Mon, 11 December 2006 04:29] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Religious Zealot forces airport to take down Christmas Trees [message #233751 is a reply to message #233567] |
Mon, 11 December 2006 06:02 |
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Sniper_De7
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The first known decorated christmas tree was in 1510 and wasn't for religious reasons
Oderint, dum metuant.
It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat. - Theodore "Teddy" Roosevelt
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| Re: Religious Zealot forces airport to take down Christmas Trees [message #233755 is a reply to message #233746] |
Mon, 11 December 2006 07:07 |
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Spoony
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| puddle_splasher wrote on Mon, 11 December 2006 05:21 |
Flood, its always the bible with you. The bible this the bible that. Why is that?
Almost every topic that gets opened, you manage to get the bible into it, why?
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yeah flooded, stop bringing the Bible into religious discussions where it obviously doesn't belong
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Renedrama [ren-i-drah-muh]
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1. the inevitable criticism one receives after doing something awful
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| Re: Religious Zealot forces airport take down Christmas Trees [message #233760 is a reply to message #233580] |
Mon, 11 December 2006 08:20 |
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SeargentSarg
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| fl00d3d wrote on Sat, 09 December 2006 23:49 |
People will do anything for attention.
Sidenote: To the best of my knowledge, "trees" (Christmas trees) have absolutely no religious value whatsoever. So what was the argument? To me the trees seem like a seasonal tradition - not a religious celebration.
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Christmas Trees have something to do with Christains / Catholics because of Saint Nick (aka "Santa")
St. Nick devoted himself to God, giving lots of gifts to the poor and needy, etc. So someone decided to make Christmas Trees the symbol of the holiday. I find it funny how you question only Christmas Trees when other religions have other random symbols.
P.S. I would like to know why all of a sudden, this year seemed to fire up Non-Christian / Catholics to be outraged about the word "Christmas" In an airport near where I live, they were too, forced to put down the tree.
But, I must agree, most commercials only say "Have a good Christmas" etc. When there are a couple more religious holidays.
(Sorry if some of this did not make sense, im kinda high, lawly.)
RenCorner.NET - Multi-Gaming Community
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| Re: Religious Zealot forces airport to take down Christmas Trees [message #233776 is a reply to message #233567] |
Mon, 11 December 2006 10:40 |
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U927
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Interesting fact: Jesus wasn't born in December; more than likely he was born in July or August. The shepherds wouldn't have taken their sheep out to graze at night, as it would have been too cold for them.
Additionaly, the reason we celebrate the birth of Jesus on December is because it coincides with the winter solstice, a Wiccan holy day called Yule (December 21). According to Wicca, this day is the day when the Goddess gives birth to a son, the God; the solstice has long been viewed by Wiccans as a time of divine births. The Christians adopted it for their use to help convert Wiccans to Christianity.
Merry Christmas!
We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence then, is not an act but a habit. - Aristotle
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[Updated on: Mon, 11 December 2006 10:42] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Religious Zealot forces airport to take down Christmas Trees [message #233789 is a reply to message #233782] |
Mon, 11 December 2006 13:47 |
puddle_splasher
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| GoArmy44 wrote on Mon, 11 December 2006 13:16 |
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The baubles, candles, angel and star, all have Christian conortations. A Christmas tree without those additions is simply a fir tree. Therefore I would be very surprised if the tree had none of the above.
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Yes you are right, thats why I was wondering if the trees in the Seattle airport had any of those things. Alot of the trees I see around here(my school campus) have none of those things. The legend you quoted is just that...a legend. Yes its a sweet story but even with your statement of 700AD it is still around 700 years after the birth of Jesus. That would be like us today recording the events of the Hundred Years War.
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Flood, its always the bible with you. The bible this the bible that. Why is that?
Almost every topic that gets opened, you manage to get the bible into it, why?
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So I decided to search the forums for flood3d's bible references you say are in "almost every topic." Why? Because I think you are full of shit...anyway only found two..this topic and a topic on the movie "The Passion of the Christ"
http://www.renegadeforums.com/index.php?SQ=b5905306f0899ca0ff13241606521619& t=search&srch=Bible&btn_submit=Search&field=all&forum_limiter=&a mp;a mp;a mp;search_logic=AND&sort_order=DESC&author=fl00d3d+
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The legend!! THE LEGEND????? Thats the fucking bible that you talk about. Its a legend.
Aghhhhh its type specific to a person????????
You misunderstood me, almost every reply on this forum, regarding Flood mentions the bible.
Certainly not, this one and only topic.
However, some of us are more mature and read, analyse and decide from more than one place.
That does not make us bad people, nor does it make you a bad person for believing in a simple book.
[Updated on: Mon, 11 December 2006 13:54] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Religious Zealot forces airport to take down Christmas Trees [message #233804 is a reply to message #233788] |
Mon, 11 December 2006 15:22 |
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cheesesoda
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| puddle_splasher wrote on Mon, 11 December 2006 15:45 |
| U927 wrote on Mon, 11 December 2006 11:40 |
Interesting fact: Jesus wasn't born in December; more than likely he was born in July or August. The shepherds wouldn't have taken their sheep out to graze at night, as it would have been too cold for them.
Additionaly, the reason we celebrate the birth of Jesus on December is because it coincides with the winter solstice, a Wiccan holy day called Yule (December 21). According to Wicca, this day is the day when the Goddess gives birth to a son, the God; the solstice has long been viewed by Wiccans as a time of divine births. The Christians adopted it for their use to help convert Wiccans to Christianity.
Merry Christmas!
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THE BIBLE DOES NOT AGREE!!
So you MUST be wrong 
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Pray tell, where does the Bible disagree? Oh wait, you're going to want me to Google it, or are you going to actually show validating proof of this absurd claim?
whoa.
[Updated on: Mon, 11 December 2006 15:22] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Religious Zealot forces airport to take down Christmas Trees [message #233805 is a reply to message #233789] |
Mon, 11 December 2006 15:23 |
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GoArmy44
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| Quote: |
However, some of us are more mature and read, analyse and decide from more than one place.
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Yes, its always good to have more than one source when studying history. Other than the bible, Tacitus and Josephus both mention Jesus in their writings, of which Tacitus is considered the premier historian of the era. But for religious dealings I turn no farther than the bible. Like you said I am not a bad person because of this and if someone does not believe that, they are no more wrong than I am.
For you being more mature than I am, your language, style of writing, and your seemingly out of the blue insults to flood3d make me believe you are no more mature than any of us here.
Reconcilia Rem Publicam!
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| Re: Religious Zealot forces airport to take down Christmas Trees [message #233808 is a reply to message #233804] |
Mon, 11 December 2006 15:34 |
puddle_splasher
Messages: 595
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| j_ball430 wrote on Mon, 11 December 2006 17:22 |
| puddle_splasher wrote on Mon, 11 December 2006 15:45 |
| U927 wrote on Mon, 11 December 2006 11:40 |
Interesting fact: Jesus wasn't born in December; more than likely he was born in July or August. The shepherds wouldn't have taken their sheep out to graze at night, as it would have been too cold for them.
Additionaly, the reason we celebrate the birth of Jesus on December is because it coincides with the winter solstice, a Wiccan holy day called Yule (December 21). According to Wicca, this day is the day when the Goddess gives birth to a son, the God; the solstice has long been viewed by Wiccans as a time of divine births. The Christians adopted it for their use to help convert Wiccans to Christianity.
Merry Christmas!
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THE BIBLE DOES NOT AGREE!!
So you MUST be wrong
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Pray tell, where does the Bible disagree? Oh wait, you're going to want me to Google it, or are you going to actually show validating proof of this absurd claim?
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Show me your claim that Christmas trees are not mentioned in the Bible.
You are reading from a BOOK!!! a book that was written and translated, rewritten and translated, many times over and still you believe, in such a book!!!
So you show me that the bible, the volume of the sacred law, mentions no Christmas tree.
Go on prove to me that its not mentioned.
You must understand that this is about faith!! Not proof, because as you cannot give me proof, neither can I.
However its all about translations, hopefully we agree to disagree.
So for all the kids that are here, I ask ask that you put a Christmas tree and ask santa to lay your gifts at the bottom of it.
Another edit for Army!!
My friend and I say that sincerely. You are one of the few that agree with looking outwith the Bible. Thats all I ask. For where truth may lie in one book, so must some lies. Seek and ye shall find. Ask and ye shall hear. Knock and it shall be answered.
TY Army.
[Updated on: Mon, 11 December 2006 15:38] Report message to a moderator |
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