Home » General Discussions » General Discussion » A sniff of democracy (aka ACK vote)
| Re: A sniff of democracy (aka ACK vote) [message #224957 is a reply to message #224561] |
Fri, 06 October 2006 04:56   |
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Sniper_De7
Messages: 866
Registered: April 2004
Location: Wisconsin
Karma: 0
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Ack's blackmailing you? .. How? Because if he had wanted something from you, it sure doesn't seem like he's getting it. so wouldn't he have posted it, if he was intent on giving out private information, for whatever he wants?
Oderint, dum metuant.
It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat. - Theodore "Teddy" Roosevelt
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| Re: A sniff of democracy (aka ACK vote) [message #224978 is a reply to message #224561] |
Fri, 06 October 2006 06:40 |
KIRBY-098
Messages: 338
Registered: July 2006
Karma: 0
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Is it really so foolish?
Who we used to be has very little bearing on who we are now, and how we treat others now. I would really hate for my loved ones to judge me now for what I did in the Navy.
For all your defense of him, I still have yet to see one valid reason he should be allowed to continue on.
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| Re: A sniff of democracy (aka ACK vote) [message #224982 is a reply to message #224978] |
Fri, 06 October 2006 06:51 |
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cheesesoda
Messages: 6507
Registered: March 2003
Location: Jackson, Michigan
Karma: 0
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General (5 Stars) |
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| KIRBY-098 |
Who we used to be has very little bearing on who we are now, and how we treat others now. I would really hate for my loved ones to judge me now for what I did in the Navy.
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You know, that helps my argument, as well...
What everybody knows him for is the Reborn bashing, the flaming, etc... Why not judge him on what's happened lately?
Non-sensical CAPS LOCK posts... they were pretty damn entertaining. Nobody got the fact that he was just getting a rise out of everybody, just like JohnDoe was doing in the 'Bash Crimson' thread. I don't see JohnDoe's head being on the chopping block...
You have the cats thing... the people who donated him money didn't have a problem for what he used the money for. Not to mention it was brought about by a scorned woman. Well... that's actually quite irrelevant, now that I think of it. This happened in ANOTHER community OUTSIDE of this forum... therefore, if you judge on this, you have no merit for it. End of story.
This whole 'Crimson lying' ordeal... what is so bad in what he's done? I fail to see where bringing up an accusation against someone when it has merit is a bad thing. People may disagree on this, but as a whole, I don't see where this is a big hit on his perceived character. In my opinion, it hurts Crimson more than it does him. The logs that exposed weren't of private information, nor were the ones that he sent to me. He hasn't done anything to personally attack Crimson, just expose lies.
As a whole, if we do as you suggested and judge on recent behavior... I say he hasn't done anything wrong. Spoony's head should be on the chopping block along with Jimbo's, mine, and others' if what Aircraftkiller has done is deserving of a ban.
whoa.
[Updated on: Fri, 06 October 2006 06:53] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: A sniff of democracy (aka ACK vote) [message #224987 is a reply to message #224982] |
Fri, 06 October 2006 07:15 |
KIRBY-098
Messages: 338
Registered: July 2006
Karma: 0
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| j_ball430 wrote on Fri, 06 October 2006 15:51 |
| KIRBY-098 |
Who we used to be has very little bearing on who we are now, and how we treat others now. I would really hate for my loved ones to judge me now for what I did in the Navy.
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You know, that helps my argument, as well...
What everybody knows him for is the Reborn bashing, the flaming, etc... Why not judge him on what's happened lately?
Non-sensical CAPS LOCK posts... they were pretty damn entertaining. Nobody got the fact that he was just getting a rise out of everybody, just like JohnDoe was doing in the 'Bash Crimson' thread. I don't see JohnDoe's head being on the chopping block...
You have the cats thing... the people who donated him money didn't have a problem for what he used the money for. Not to mention it was brought about by a scorned woman. Well... that's actually quite irrelevant, now that I think of it. This happened in ANOTHER community OUTSIDE of this forum... therefore, if you judge on this, you have no merit for it. End of story.
This whole 'Crimson lying' ordeal... what is so bad in what he's done? I fail to see where bringing up an accusation against someone when it has merit is a bad thing. People may disagree on this, but as a whole, I don't see where this is a big hit on his perceived character. In my opinion, it hurts Crimson more than it does him. The logs that exposed weren't of private information, nor were the ones that he sent to me. He hasn't done anything to personally attack Crimson, just expose lies.
As a whole, if we do as you suggested and judge on recent behavior... I say he hasn't done anything wrong. Spoony's head should be on the chopping block along with Jimbo's, mine, and others' if what Aircraftkiller has done is deserving of a ban.
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I find it very interesting how you choose to interpret any of the above listed actions as appropriate or justified.
The very fact that he did something hurtful at all is a huge indicator of his viciousness and vindictive nature.
Whether you two buddies consider it ok or not, the third party involved does not, and that alone should cause you to pause and say "this isn't right for me to have these logs. I don't have permission to read them from all parties."
Why were log being recorded of a peronal conversation at all?
That also spaks volumes about personal character. Was character assasination preplanned?
Your arguments don't hold up. It seems like you're merely trying to polish this turd to make it appear better than it really is.
And as for the rest of you and your actions of late:
If I were admin, you'd all be gone until you learned that respect is earned through intelligent debate, not hateful ranting.
Am I a Crimson fanboy? Not a chance in Hades. I find her anti-God remarks in her sig offensive in a major way, and the moderation of this forum is a shambles and a free for all for tards throughout the c&c community.
Renforums used to be something much greater, and much has been lost because a decent, and even handed approach to dialogue doesn't exist
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| Re: A sniff of democracy (aka ACK vote) [message #224988 is a reply to message #224982] |
Fri, 06 October 2006 07:18 |
PackHunter
Messages: 487
Registered: November 2004
Location: Holland
Karma: 0
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Commander |
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| j_ball430 wrote on Fri, 06 October 2006 09:51 |
...
Spoony's head should be on the chopping block along with Jimbo's, mine, and others
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Yes, that would be a great idea imo, but for now I am content with Ack's.
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| Re: A sniff of democracy (aka ACK vote) [message #224998 is a reply to message #224987] |
Fri, 06 October 2006 07:44 |
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cheesesoda
Messages: 6507
Registered: March 2003
Location: Jackson, Michigan
Karma: 0
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General (5 Stars) |
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| KIRBY-098 |
I find it very interesting how you choose to interpret any of the above listed actions as appropriate or justified.
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I'm not justifying the "cat incident", but it has no bearing on whether or not he should be banned.
I also fail to see how this whole "Crimson lying" situation is such a bad bad thing.
| KIRBY-098 |
The very fact that he did something hurtful at all is a huge indicator of his viciousness and vindictive nature.
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Because we're all perfect, right? I've done my fair share of things. I stole from my employer a couple years ago, but it doesn't mean that I am or was a bad person... it was just something that shouldn't have been done.
| KIRBY-098 |
Whether you two buddies consider it ok or not, the third party involved does not, and that alone should cause you to pause and say "this isn't right for me to have these logs. I don't have permission to read them from all parties."
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I've just been too lazy to delete them. I didn't feel right about reading them, so I haven't.
| KIRBY-098 |
Why were log being recorded of a peronal conversation at all?
That also spaks volumes about personal character. Was character assasination preplanned?
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I log all of my IRC conversations. Private or public. I have every right to do so, and it certainly isn't some result of any preplanning to turn on someone. I like copies of my conversations, in case I forget something or I choose to read back on something I discussed earlier. Logging does come in handy.
whoa.
[Updated on: Fri, 06 October 2006 07:45] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: A sniff of democracy (aka ACK vote) [message #224999 is a reply to message #224998] |
Fri, 06 October 2006 07:52 |
KIRBY-098
Messages: 338
Registered: July 2006
Karma: 0
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We aren't all perfect, no.
But did you learn from that experience, and do you repat the behavior again and again?
Because if that were to happen you are indeed still the same person you were when you perpetrated that crime.
Most of us learn from our experiences. We become better people relationally, and socially.
Has Mr. ACK? I see a perpetual downward spiral over the last five years. I cannot fathom how you might interpret he's the better person.
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| Re: A sniff of democracy (aka ACK vote) [message #225001 is a reply to message #224999] |
Fri, 06 October 2006 07:59 |
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cheesesoda
Messages: 6507
Registered: March 2003
Location: Jackson, Michigan
Karma: 0
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General (5 Stars) |
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| KIRBY-098 |
We aren't all perfect, no.
But did you learn from that experience, and do you repat the behavior again and again?
Because if that were to happen you are indeed still the same person you were when you perpetrated that crime.
Most of us learn from our experiences. We become better people relationally, and socially.
Has Mr. ACK? I see a perpetual downward spiral over the last five years. I cannot fathom how you might interpret he's the better person.
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Yes, I learned from the experience. I also have yet to repeat the same mistake.
I still don't see how this is a downward spiral for him. All I can see is a guy using the Internet who has pissed off a lot of people and has done some stupid things. However, that's not relevant for him being banned.
What he's done on these forums may be disrespectful, annoying, and downright mean, but on a forum with no rules, how can you say this is a bannable offense?
whoa.
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| Re: A sniff of democracy (aka ACK vote) [message #225002 is a reply to message #224998] |
Fri, 06 October 2006 08:02 |
KIRBY-098
Messages: 338
Registered: July 2006
Karma: 0
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| j_ball430 wrote on Fri, 06 October 2006 09:44 |
I log all of my IRC conversations. Private or public. I have every right to do so, and it certainly isn't some result of any preplanning to turn on someone. I like copies of my conversations, in case I forget something or I choose to read back on something I discussed earlier. Logging does come in handy.
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Do you turn them over to others without the permission of the person that partook in the conversation?
That's the issue.
I am so very glad you chose to do the right thing. Delete them now, so you can clear your conscience.
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| Re: A sniff of democracy (aka ACK vote) [message #225005 is a reply to message #225001] |
Fri, 06 October 2006 08:05 |
KIRBY-098
Messages: 338
Registered: July 2006
Karma: 0
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| j_ball430 wrote on Fri, 06 October 2006 09:59 |
Yes, I learned from the experience. I also have yet to repeat the same mistake.
I still don't see how this is a downward spiral for him. All I can see is a guy using the Internet who has pissed off a lot of people and has done some stupid things. However, that's not relevant for him being banned.
What he's done on these forums may be disrespectful, annoying, and downright mean, but on a forum with no rules, how can you say this is a bannable offense?
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Well, the lack of rules and moderation is also something I take issue with.
If someone is mean, disrespectful and annoying they are a detraction from a community in any form, and need to be regulated. Once they become productive, they can be assimilated back into the community.
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| Re: A sniff of democracy (aka ACK vote) [message #225008 is a reply to message #225002] |
Fri, 06 October 2006 08:12 |
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cheesesoda
Messages: 6507
Registered: March 2003
Location: Jackson, Michigan
Karma: 0
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General (5 Stars) |
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| KIRBY-098 wrote on Fri, 06 October 2006 11:02 |
| j_ball430 wrote on Fri, 06 October 2006 09:44 |
I log all of my IRC conversations. Private or public. I have every right to do so, and it certainly isn't some result of any preplanning to turn on someone. I like copies of my conversations, in case I forget something or I choose to read back on something I discussed earlier. Logging does come in handy.
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Do you turn them over to others without the permission of the person that partook in the conversation?
That's the issue.
I am so very glad you chose to do the right thing. Delete them now, so you can clear your conscience.
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I have pasted bits of my conversation to others without the consent of the other person. It's not any personal information, nor is it anything I use against the other person. Majority of my private conversations remain buried in my log folder collecting dust.
Edit: I deleted the logs. I proved that they're not tampered with, so that purpose was fufilled.
whoa.
[Updated on: Fri, 06 October 2006 08:13] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: A sniff of democracy (aka ACK vote) [message #225012 is a reply to message #225005] |
Fri, 06 October 2006 08:23 |
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cheesesoda
Messages: 6507
Registered: March 2003
Location: Jackson, Michigan
Karma: 0
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General (5 Stars) |
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| KIRBY-098 wrote on Fri, 06 October 2006 11:05 |
| j_ball430 wrote on Fri, 06 October 2006 09:59 |
Yes, I learned from the experience. I also have yet to repeat the same mistake.
I still don't see how this is a downward spiral for him. All I can see is a guy using the Internet who has pissed off a lot of people and has done some stupid things. However, that's not relevant for him being banned.
What he's done on these forums may be disrespectful, annoying, and downright mean, but on a forum with no rules, how can you say this is a bannable offense?
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Well, the lack of rules and moderation is also something I take issue with.
If someone is mean, disrespectful and annoying they are a detraction from a community in any form, and need to be regulated. Once they become productive, they can be assimilated back into the community.
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Everybody becomes a detraction from the community at some point. Some more than others, I agree.
Banning someone because of it? Temporarily, maybe, but I don't see any need for something permanent. He's been allowed to get away with it, as well as everybody else, so why does he suddenly deserve a permanent ban?
whoa.
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| Re: A sniff of democracy (aka ACK vote) [message #225013 is a reply to message #224561] |
Fri, 06 October 2006 08:27 |
KIRBY-098
Messages: 338
Registered: July 2006
Karma: 0
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I'm not advocating a perma ban.
Should have done it anyways Warranto. You would have maintained your integrity and been vindicated eventually. In fact I see four moderators on right now watching this happen.
No bans, no warning, and no deletion of personal attacks.
Get busy.
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| Re: A sniff of democracy (aka ACK vote) [message #225025 is a reply to message #225020] |
Fri, 06 October 2006 08:45 |
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warranto
Messages: 2584
Registered: February 2003
Location: Alberta, Canada
Karma: 0
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General (2 Stars) |
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| KIRBY-098 wrote on Fri, 06 October 2006 09:34 |
If it transgresses your ethical standard then in that case, resigning in protest is an honorable and respectable thing to do.
Never mitigate your own personal standards. Do what is right.
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Meh, I don't really care enough to worry about it conflicting with the standards I have. It's simply a forum, and I was asked to assist in moderating it. I'll do the job because I was given it, and I'll continue to do it until I get it taken away.
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Blazer said that the rules is basically "common sense". If it's "common sense" to you to remove some posts based on the idea that you think they're inappropriate... remove them. I don't think Blazer would argue with your decision.
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When it's a minor infraction, there is always the question of "it's bad, but it's so small that is it bad enough to warrant action?" Ultimately, if I find a post/thread is equal to another thread that was allowed to continue, in terms of "damaging" content, then I'll follow that.
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| Re: A sniff of democracy (aka ACK vote) [message #225030 is a reply to message #224561] |
Fri, 06 October 2006 09:11 |
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Crimson
Messages: 7429
Registered: February 2003
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Karma: 0
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General (5 Stars)
ADMINISTRATOR |
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I can promise you that my "retribution" and making up for past events does include better and more distinct rules of conduct. I just don't think such a conversation will be very productive until we decide whether certain individuals will be staying or going.
Other "heads" will most likely be chopped, but not all will get the decency of a vote.
I'm the bawss.
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| Re: A sniff of democracy (aka ACK vote) [message #225036 is a reply to message #224561] |
Fri, 06 October 2006 09:51 |
KIRBY-098
Messages: 338
Registered: July 2006
Karma: 0
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I don't hate you at all.
I don't know why you insist on perpetuating that falsehood.
And no, that does not mean I want to ever run into you in the course of this life.
I find you repugnant, but I have no hatred toward ANYONE here.
As much as you wish to deny it, this forum is a reflection of what your disposition is and I want no part of it.
k?
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