Home » General Discussions » General Discussion » Server owners, or servers in general...
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| Re: Server owners, or servers in general... [message #193169 is a reply to message #192863] |
Sat, 18 March 2006 00:59   |
Homey
Messages: 1084
Registered: February 2003
Location: Canada
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General (1 Star) |
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This is the internet, i'll do and say whatever the hell I want to, as should everyone else. If you don't like it, go outside. Also violence is a much greater influence than swearing. Personally when I swear or express any anger I feel better after. I have no problem with anyone expressing how they feel or their opinion, especially on the net.
Homey
[Updated on: Sat, 18 March 2006 01:02] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Server owners, or servers in general... [message #193191 is a reply to message #193169] |
Sat, 18 March 2006 05:08 |
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Goztow
Messages: 9735
Registered: March 2005
Location: Belgium
Karma: 13
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General (5 Stars)
Goztoe |
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| Homey wrote on Sat, 18 March 2006 02:59 |
This is the internet, i'll do and say whatever the hell I want to, as should everyone else. If you don't like it, go outside. Also violence is a much greater influence than swearing. Personally when I swear or express any anger I feel better after. I have no problem with anyone expressing how they feel or their opinion, especially on the net.
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People like you are the reason why such rules have to be instored. Idiot.
You can find me in The KOSs2 (TK2) discord while I'm playing. Feel free to come and say hi! TK2 discord
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| Re: Server owners, or servers in general... [message #193199 is a reply to message #193191] |
Sat, 18 March 2006 07:30 |
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Dave Mason
Messages: 2357
Registered: April 2004
Location: Shropshire, England
Karma: 0
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General (2 Stars) |
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| Goztow wrote on Sat, 18 March 2006 12:08 |
| Homey wrote on Sat, 18 March 2006 02:59 |
This is the internet, i'll do and say whatever the hell I want to, as should everyone else. If you don't like it, go outside. Also violence is a much greater influence than swearing. Personally when I swear or express any anger I feel better after. I have no problem with anyone expressing how they feel or their opinion, especially on the net.
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People like you are the reason why such rules have to be instored. Idiot.
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I didn't actually think it was possible for you to post any more sensless rubbish. Your fingers would appear to not only do your typing but your thinking aswell.
Please for the love of Christ disconnect your computer from the Internet.
www.myspace.com/midas
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| Re: Server owners, or servers in general... [message #193204 is a reply to message #193110] |
Sat, 18 March 2006 09:37 |
genetix
Messages: 392
Registered: July 2003
Location: Saskatchewan Canada
Karma: 0
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Commander |
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| Sniper_De7 wrote on Fri, 17 March 2006 08:42 |
| genetix wrote on Thu, 16 March 2006 23:02 |
I'm an administrator for a BF2 64 player ranked server. We promote a semi swear free community and everyone loves it. Sure we aren't really strict on swearing but we get a lot of compliments about it. You would be amazed at how many people under the age of 15 play war games. I simply consider it respect. Probably why last time I check our BF2 server was ranked in the top 5.
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You basically just said that your server allows swearing and the people adore you for it.
I mean every server that allows semi swearing (as you call it, I mean most or all that I've ever been that allows swearing, doesn't allow anything too extreme - How many people have I seen go beyond that point and get kicked? None what-so-ever that I can recall. That said, obviously people don't really ever get out of hand. It's just a senseless rule to have, and that's the argument here. If all servers had no swearing would you say to quit the game? If you're going to argue, at least argue whether or not it's a senseless rule. As far as I can tell, no one really ever abuses it to the level of absurdity. The game is meant for teens, meaning by this age, children would have and are comfortable around swear words and violence (this is where parenting comes in and teaching your children about violence)
We all already know server owners get to do what they want. If they want to be asshats and ban/kick people who are better than them, then that's their perogative. None of this makes something right. So if you're going to argue that a server owner can do whatever he wants with his server, it holds no bearing on making it right. It's just forcing his opinion to everyone else.
Trying to ban swearing is a futile attempt to rid seeing swearing elsewhere. You'll find it in school (in case where you missed the last 6+ grades of your school, kids are using swear words) You'll find it in the street. You'll find swearing practically everywhere, and trying helplessly to avoid it is not the solution.
it's not like servers with no swearing ever not see swearing. You'll still see people swear so that throws the whole "my kid plays this game" Because people either.
A) Don't know the rules.
B) Don't give a damn about rules they believe are pointless
C) Purposely break rules
Banning swearing, is like banning alcohol in that there's still going to be people who swear, and there always will be. If you really don't want your child to see swearing.. you should really not let them play games online. That makes more sense to me than any other solution.
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Let me clear that up even though it was posted a while ago. The reason people are happy is because we don't allow obvious swears like "Fuck"
We do allow things like "WTF"
Why? How many little kids know what "WTF" means? Its a lot less harsh and obvious then actually swearing. Plus its annoying when all you see in the public chat menu is people lipin off.
I personally enforce it because its a sign of respect. You shouldn't need to swear. I normally let symbolized stuff go because younger audiences don't understand a lot of the terms yet.
Thats why I get compliments about our server. Lots of the better BF2 players like it aswell. Its more fun when people aren't lipin off left right and center.
Puzzle - Petals Around the Rose
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| Re: Server owners, or servers in general... [message #193213 is a reply to message #193211] |
Sat, 18 March 2006 11:12 |
msgtpain
Messages: 663
Registered: March 2003
Location: Montana
Karma: 0
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Colonel |
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| m1a1_abrams wrote on Sat, 18 March 2006 12:41 |
It is of course the right of server owners to enforce their beliefs on players just because they want to, but this suggestion that "swear words" themselves are inherently bad and wrong is annoying. If you believe that a particular group of letters placed together is evil or something, then you can provide me with real world evidence for why that is? Otherwise it's very similar to a religious belief, hence my earlier example about an extremist Mulsim expecting all non-Muslims to conform to his ideals because he finds anything else offensive.
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This can easily be summed up with a little exercise: Next time you are talking to your mom, boss, grandma, teacher, aunt, blah, blah blah... Please have a mic ready then tell them to "Fuck off" in a non-joking, angry voice... then, post the capture wave file of your words and their reaction for us all to hear.
If you're not willing to, for each and every one above; why is that?
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| Re: Server owners, or servers in general... [message #193216 is a reply to message #193215] |
Sat, 18 March 2006 11:27 |
msgtpain
Messages: 663
Registered: March 2003
Location: Montana
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Colonel |
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| Aircraftkiller wrote on Sat, 18 March 2006 13:19 |
I'm not really willing to run over my family with a Mammoth Tank just to capture their reaction for an experiment, but that doesn't really invalidate anyone's point here.
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My mistake, I was under the impression we were talking about real-world scenarios.. When you get a hold of a mammoth tank, give me a buzz... However, it actually does invalidate the point.. If you're not willing to do it because of the "harm" or "effect" that it will cause, then you intentionally DO NOT do something because of how it will affect others. Swearing is no different.
If it's "Just a word", then why is it so important to use "those" words? blueberry is a word too; I don't see you calling everyone blueberries.
[Updated on: Sat, 18 March 2006 11:30] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Server owners, or servers in general... [message #193219 is a reply to message #192863] |
Sat, 18 March 2006 12:11 |
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Aircraftkiller
Messages: 8213
Registered: February 2003
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So your argument is that we're bound to server regulations (Although you allowed swearing en-masse a long time ago when the Pits first started, just as an interesting note) of no-swearing and that the action itself is wrong. I think where you and I (And pretty much everyone arguing for swearing as much as they fucking like) disagree here is that the action of swearing is no different than the action of killing a player in the game.
For example, you believe swearing to be a harmful thing. To some people, sure... Maybe it is. I grew up around it, having learned how to say shit like that when I was eight years old. I suspect it's no different today. The people complaining about it tend to be rather old compared to current players (Speaking 35+ years) because they have children that play the game. Teen rating notwithstanding, that being covered already; I believe most of the ones complaining are just sensitive or have lost touch with what it was like to be younger and surrounded by words like that.
They've been around for centuries now, spoken by almost any conceivable person in this country. I bet some baby has said "Fuck" as its first word, somewhere. As we all know, you're free to run your server any way you (you in general) wish. As this thread proves, we're free to whine, bitch and moan about how stupid we think your server's rules are.
So back to my point, I don't see a difference between the action of killing a player in-game and swearing. Both are equally hostile actions. Would you raise a rifle to your family to prove this point? If not, explain why? Seems ridiculous, doesn't it?
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| Re: Server owners, or servers in general... [message #193222 is a reply to message #193213] |
Sat, 18 March 2006 12:40 |
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m1a1_abrams
Messages: 375
Registered: August 2003
Karma: 0
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Commander |
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| msgtpain wrote on Sat, 18 March 2006 13:12 |
This can easily be summed up with a little exercise: Next time you are talking to your mom, boss, grandma, teacher, aunt, blah, blah blah... Please have a mic ready then tell them to "Fuck off" in a non-joking, angry voice... then, post the capture wave file of your words and their reaction for us all to hear.
If you're not willing to, for each and every one above; why is that?
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Hey man I think you missed the point. I thought I made it clear earlier in this thread that I'm not an anarchist who thinks people should be able to say anything without any consequences. I think it's wrong to deliberately insult other people, I just don't think that any given word is wrong no matter the context. I wouldn't tell a family member to "shut up" or "go away", nevermind "fuck off". The former pair of phrases mean can mean exactly the same thing, yet they aren't swear words... hence my opinion that the hurtful sentiment is the only thing wrong, not the word.
I do swear in frustration around my parents and brothers btw, like if I stub my toe on something. That would be anything from "shit", "fuck", "bugger", "bastard"... or perhaps all of them combined if it *really* hurt  I wouldn't swear around elderly relatives though, because even though I think they're misguided to object to my swearing, I expect they are past the point that I can reason with a belief they've been indoctrinated with for 70+ years. A boss or teacher? Well I think that's rather unfair since they have the power to terminate your employment or education. If they made it clear they didn't want me to swear then I wouldn't have a lot of choice in the matter would I? It would be nothing to do with saving their feelings... more like looking out for myself.
[Updated on: Sat, 18 March 2006 12:50] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Server owners, or servers in general... [message #193223 is a reply to message #193222] |
Sat, 18 March 2006 12:51 |
msgtpain
Messages: 663
Registered: March 2003
Location: Montana
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Colonel |
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Ack, I do understand how you coorelate the two. However, my point is that they are actually seperate actions and can't simply be "lumped" together.
When you go in to play the game, you know that you are entering a game where simulated killing is taking place. As you are playing, you kill other characters, and they kill you. When I play, I never feel like I "am" the person I'm playing.. When you kill me, it doesn't make me angry, pissed, or any other type of emotion to where I would want to do anything other than kill your character back.
When you tell me to "fuck off", you are attacking me.. not my character. You have transitioned from the online game to a real-world conversation. You aren't telling Havoc to fuck off, you're telling the person controlling Havoc. When cussing transcends that boundary, in my opinion, it is unacceptable. While I think typing "shit" is pointless and childish, I certainly have never kicked for it. You may be warned by the bot, but he can't really detect tone or inflection, so you're punished by AI.
If you wouldn't tell me to fuck off to my face, unless we of course were friends, and I knew it was an off-the-cuff remark, why do it in the game?
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| Re: Server owners, or servers in general... [message #193226 is a reply to message #192863] |
Sat, 18 March 2006 13:34 |
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Crimson
Messages: 7429
Registered: February 2003
Location: Phoenix, AZ
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General (5 Stars)
ADMINISTRATOR |
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When I play in-game I interpret the other players as my friends who are playing a game. I will tell my friends to fuck off, and I'd even tell my grandma to fuck off if she fragged me in-game.
And just for comparison, my server is full or close to it about 80% of the time and I allow swearing. To each his own but allowing swearing hasn't inhibited my server one bit.
I'm the bawss.
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| Re: Server owners, or servers in general... [message #193229 is a reply to message #192863] |
Sat, 18 March 2006 13:46 |
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Aircraftkiller
Messages: 8213
Registered: February 2003
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The problem there lies with the ESRB rating of teen. Straight from the ESRB website:
Command & Conquer Renegade Westwood Studios,Inc. PC Teen (13+) Blood,Violence
With a rating of at least 13+, you're expecting to hear things like "You fucking asshole" and any variation of other attacks on people in-game. When I play a game like CounterStrike, I expect to see people being assholes to each other. Not only is it because of the reputation of CS players, but also because of the ESRB rating. The higher the rating, the more one can logically expect to find malevolent players that simply play to piss everyone off.
So yes, I'll agree with you that it does go a bit far to just attack someone like that, but what difference does it make as to what words you use? A1 has the right idea here, it's the meaning behind them... Not the words themselves.
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| Re: Server owners, or servers in general... [message #193233 is a reply to message #192863] |
Sat, 18 March 2006 14:20 |
msgtpain
Messages: 663
Registered: March 2003
Location: Montana
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Colonel |
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I disagree. the reason you chose the words you do is because of the power and impact behind them. As I stated in a previous post, which you ignored, you don't go around calling people "blueberries".. because there is no power behind that. Your intent is to be callous, and the only word colorful enough to express your true feelings are swear words; By arguing that they are "just words", you are defeating your own argument, blueberry is a word too.
[Updated on: Sat, 18 March 2006 14:21] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Server owners, or servers in general... [message #193245 is a reply to message #193199] |
Sat, 18 March 2006 16:42 |
Homey
Messages: 1084
Registered: February 2003
Location: Canada
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General (1 Star) |
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| DJM wrote on Sat, 18 March 2006 09:30 |
| Goztow wrote on Sat, 18 March 2006 12:08 |
| Homey wrote on Sat, 18 March 2006 02:59 |
This is the internet, i'll do and say whatever the hell I want to, as should everyone else. If you don't like it, go outside. Also violence is a much greater influence than swearing. Personally when I swear or express any anger I feel better after. I have no problem with anyone expressing how they feel or their opinion, especially on the net.
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People like you are the reason why such rules have to be instored. Idiot.
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I didn't actually think it was possible for you to post any more sensless rubbish. Your fingers would appear to not only do your typing but your thinking aswell.
Please for the love of Christ disconnect your computer from the Internet.
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Omg this guy told me to do something on the net, I better do it. Who gives a fuck?
Homey
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| Re: Server owners, or servers in general... [message #193247 is a reply to message #193245] |
Sat, 18 March 2006 16:51 |
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Dave Mason
Messages: 2357
Registered: April 2004
Location: Shropshire, England
Karma: 0
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General (2 Stars) |
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| Homey wrote on Sat, 18 March 2006 23:42 |
| DJM wrote on Sat, 18 March 2006 09:30 |
| Goztow wrote on Sat, 18 March 2006 12:08 |
| Homey wrote on Sat, 18 March 2006 02:59 |
This is the internet, i'll do and say whatever the hell I want to, as should everyone else. If you don't like it, go outside. Also violence is a much greater influence than swearing. Personally when I swear or express any anger I feel better after. I have no problem with anyone expressing how they feel or their opinion, especially on the net.
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People like you are the reason why such rules have to be instored. Idiot.
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I didn't actually think it was possible for you to post any more sensless rubbish. Your fingers would appear to not only do your typing but your thinking aswell.
Please for the love of Christ disconnect your computer from the Internet.
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Omg this guy told me to do something on the net, I better do it. Who gives a fuck?
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I was talking about Goztow. I agree with you fully on this matter.
www.myspace.com/midas
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| Re: Server owners, or servers in general... [message #193249 is a reply to message #193247] |
Sat, 18 March 2006 17:02 |
Homey
Messages: 1084
Registered: February 2003
Location: Canada
Karma: 0
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General (1 Star) |
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| DJM wrote on Sat, 18 March 2006 18:51 |
| Homey wrote on Sat, 18 March 2006 23:42 |
| DJM wrote on Sat, 18 March 2006 09:30 |
| Goztow wrote on Sat, 18 March 2006 12:08 |
| Homey wrote on Sat, 18 March 2006 02:59 |
This is the internet, i'll do and say whatever the hell I want to, as should everyone else. If you don't like it, go outside. Also violence is a much greater influence than swearing. Personally when I swear or express any anger I feel better after. I have no problem with anyone expressing how they feel or their opinion, especially on the net.
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People like you are the reason why such rules have to be instored. Idiot.
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I didn't actually think it was possible for you to post any more sensless rubbish. Your fingers would appear to not only do your typing but your thinking aswell.
Please for the love of Christ disconnect your computer from the Internet.
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Omg this guy told me to do something on the net, I better do it. Who gives a fuck?
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I was talking about Goztow. I agree with you fully on this matter.
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Well then, my apologies. I still don't see why this is such a big deal, half the time when people say stuff I don't even know it appeared in the chatbox.
Homey
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| Re: Server owners, or servers in general... [message #195506 is a reply to message #192863] |
Fri, 07 April 2006 21:11 |
Berkut
Messages: 508
Registered: July 2005
Location: N/A
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Colonel |
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I don't really care about cussing. Sure, there are more original ways to insult someone, but if you have to cuss, have at it. You won't see me doing it, though.
As far as being "attacked" by cussing, I don't care. It's just one less person to donate/rec/repair/generally agree with in the future. (Crim is an exception, though. I usually support administrators and their cadre unless they do something really offensive. Which she hasn't.)
In the end, though, as far as I care, your language is between you and God.
[Updated on: Fri, 07 April 2006 21:12] Report message to a moderator |
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