Home » Renegade Discussions » Tactics and Strategies » Vehicles vs Infantry
| Vehicles vs Infantry [message #189961] |
Tue, 14 February 2006 14:36  |
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terminator 101
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Registered: March 2003
Location: Toronto
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Worst Case Scenario
Map: Under, Estimated number of people: 20
Almost everyone on GDI buys vehicles, and block the entrance to the Nod base, and Nod only buys 2 artilleries(or almost none) and try to defend, but no one repairs the artilleries or buys any more or any other vehicles.
Who do you think is going to win? GDI of course.
I feel that Infantry in Renegade is a bit underpowered, because they have limited ammo, and they don't do as much damage as vehicles, unless the are used in groups of at least 3(which is rare)
This ammo limit is a bit annoying, and it makes infantry less usefull too.
I think that at least the basic Infantry should have infinite ammo.
Vehicles on the other hand are much more useful in almost any kind of situation.
Yes, 5 Raveshaws can destroy whole army of tanks, but for base attacking, they are not that good.
I can't think of any thing else right now, but you get the idea.
In most games that I play on n00bstories.com servers(those are mostly the only servers that I play on), if team A buys many vehicles and team B does not, team B is doomed(on any map).
The point is, if most people on your team prefer only infantry, your team is doomed.
One more thing that I wanted to say. For past few days that I have been playing, the teams are hardly ever balanced. It is usually like this: one team full of noobs(mostly), other has 3 more more good players(with very fast computers of course) who do all the work. And also, often I am one of the few people who repair others.
Usually 2 out of 15 people (or more likely one) repair others, which makes me think that many people are forgetting that this is a team based strategy game. One person alone can't really do squat.
"It is time you saw the future, while you still have human eyes"
Cheaters only Cheat themselves!
so
Hasta la vista, baby!
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| Re: Vehicles vs Infantry [message #189981 is a reply to message #189961] |
Tue, 14 February 2006 18:34  |
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Dr. Lithius
Messages: 609
Registered: March 2005
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Two words: Chem Sprayer.
Edit: Actually, lemme add a little to that. With a Chem Sprayer, I have a 92% success rate of owning a Mammoth Tank and about a 60% success rate of taking out a Medium Tank.(Medium Tanks have an easier time hitting targets at point-blank for some reason.) The only thing I really have trouble with are APCs with their focus on me or Humm-Vees with similar focus.
[Updated on: Tue, 14 February 2006 18:36] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Vehicles vs Infantry [message #190037 is a reply to message #189961] |
Tue, 14 February 2006 23:21 |
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m1a1_abrams
Messages: 375
Registered: August 2003
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Commander |
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I agree that infantry should have had infinite ammo and have their weapon strength balanced around that. Some characters (dare I mention the Laser Chaingunner), run out so fast that you feel like you're running all the way back to a PT as often as you're actually being useful outside your base.
However, with everyone playing in 40 player servers, vehicles are not as dominant as you make out. It's the chokepoint maps like Under and Field that are causing the situations you describe, because with only one entrance infantry get trapped behind a wall of splash damage from tank shells exploding. Remember you can only have 7-8 vehicles at any given time, while you can have as many Raveshaws/Sydneys as you have players on your team. In a one-on-one confrontation though, I'd much rather be in a Medium Tank than be a Raveshaw.
Btw, Lithius I swear you are out of your mind, LOL. You have to be desperate (i.e. run out of cash), or bored, to purposefully hunt tanks with a Chem Warrior. Sure, it will do great damage if you get close, but you need the right circumstances and terrain to sneak up on an alert tank driver. The Chem Warrior suffers from the same problems as the Laser Chaingunner... needs to maintain a constant line of sight to kill tanks which means it has to run out into the open... except that unlike the Laser Chaingunner, it has an awful, awful range, is bright green and has a huge head that ANYONE can hit. It's not a reliable character in any shape or form and it's definitely not the answer to tanks. It does have one advantage though... it's inexpensive... but if you can afford something else, why the hell would you buy a Chem Warrior?
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| Re: Vehicles vs Infantry [message #190043 is a reply to message #189961] |
Wed, 15 February 2006 00:49 |
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Spoony
Messages: 3915
Registered: January 2006
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General (3 Stars)
Tactics & Strategies Moderator |
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If you kill a med, light, arty or APC with an infantry on your own, it's not thanks to your skill, it's thanks to the driver's lack. Anyone with a brain will never lose a vehicle to an infantry player in a one-on-one situation (except maybe to a ramjet)
Unleash the Renerageâ„¢
Renedrama [ren-i-drah-muh]
- noun
1. the inevitable criticism one receives after doing something awful
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| Re: Vehicles vs Infantry [message #190060 is a reply to message #190049] |
Wed, 15 February 2006 06:13 |
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Dave Mason
Messages: 2357
Registered: April 2004
Location: Shropshire, England
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General (2 Stars) |
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| Goztow wrote on Wed, 15 February 2006 09:02 |
Only a retarded team would only rely on vehicles or only on infantry. You need a combination of both to win a good game  .
Both teams have vehicles. If you find vehicles to be overpowered, use them  .
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We both know you just clicked reveal message so don't bother ignoring it.
His point was that in public servers on Renegade these days, most people are idiots and prefer to grab a ramjet or a stealth black hand and go solo rather than buy a tank and rely on teamwork.
I know this for a fact as yesterday I went on Renegade for the first time in around 8 months and killed every building on complex with a med tank, a MRLS and a mate whilst the other team was pricking around with snipers and stealths.
www.myspace.com/midas
[Updated on: Wed, 15 February 2006 06:13] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Vehicles vs Infantry [message #190061 is a reply to message #189961] |
Wed, 15 February 2006 06:43 |
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Sniper_De7
Messages: 866
Registered: April 2004
Location: Wisconsin
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Chem warriors work so well that in clanwars if you had 10 of them and it's a 60% chance of killing med tanks and 92% on mammoths. So on field we rush out with 10 chem warriors and get only get 6 med tanks with our chem warriors. and if they're using mammoth tanks - oh well then we can get them all!
Oderint, dum metuant.
It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat. - Theodore "Teddy" Roosevelt
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| Re: Vehicles vs Infantry [message #190067 is a reply to message #190015] |
Wed, 15 February 2006 07:15 |
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Dr. Lithius
Messages: 609
Registered: March 2005
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| mrpirate wrote on Tue, 14 February 2006 21:54 |
Tell you what, you get a Chem Warrior, I'll get a Medium Tank. If you can get 100 HP off me, I'll give you $100.
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I'd take that bet, but once I widdle off 100 Armor Points, I know you'd just whine and say "That wasn't 100 HP! You lose! rofl."
Now, what I neglect to mention is that most of the time, the Medium Tanks, Mammoth Tanks, MRLS Trucks, and other things I open fire on are distracted by opening fire on our base. So, I sneak around the back and return fire from the flank. I can usually utterly decimate a Mammoth Tank if its by its lonesome and there are no Sniper units around. And yes, I do mean even if it's using shells as opposed to Tusk Missiles.
You're entitled to your opinion, mrpirate. But I will fight you tooth and nail on the usefulness of the Chem Warrior and Mutant Initiates because I know I'm right. I have proven this to myself time and time again in the field of battle and will willingly get a FRAPs video to prove it if I have to.
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| Re: Vehicles vs Infantry [message #190072 is a reply to message #189961] |
Wed, 15 February 2006 08:29 |
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Sniper_De7
Messages: 866
Registered: April 2004
Location: Wisconsin
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Just because you play against morons doesn't mean you're right. Anyone with a brain, even if they were getting killed by a chem warrior and they were a med tank, could easily just run in one direction and get away. that's not to say that the med tank wouldn't have headshotted you anyways. If it was true that chem warriors were better than tanks, then a barrage of chem warriors vs tanks would be better.
My point in the last post was that in a scenario where people don't suck (ie clanwars, or just up against anyone who at least knows how to play the game), you won't stand a single chance against them. Albeit you could maybe lose a mammoth tank to one if he didn't really know you were coming, i guess, but still any decent person would check every now and then to be able to see it in the first place. most any unit *can* kill a tank; it doesn't necessarily mean that if you can kill random idiots with it and not good people that they're better than tanks themselves.
There's a reason why people who are actually good at this game and if they wanted to win a game, they don't buy chem warriors - they buy med tanks or artys and when a team that follows suit and buys tanks themselves, or even helps in repairing an artillery, they normally win. The only thing Chem warriors would even be effective is close range, and in any situation a med tank can easily back off and shoot the chem warrior from farther away. Can't really do anything about that, can you?
and by the way, in almost any situation any unit is particularly good against mammys since they're so pathetically big and slow. all you need is a corner or something to keep going back if the mammoth decides to try and follow and kill you, only, his big ass sticks out so you can hit him while he can't hit you. and you can do this while effectively killing other tanks as well! Not be dependent that it's going to be a lone mammoth, who sucks(well it's pretty much given if it's going to be a lone mammoth, since med tanks are much more adaptable to any situation), and that the mammoth tank driver is not smart enough to look behind him every now and then. only then when he meets the said requirements, then you can go and run out into the field with a chem warrior. Instead I'll buy the tank so that we can actually hold the field and have a useful unit there.
Oderint, dum metuant.
It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat. - Theodore "Teddy" Roosevelt
[Updated on: Wed, 15 February 2006 08:33] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Vehicles vs Infantry [message #190081 is a reply to message #189961] |
Wed, 15 February 2006 09:44 |
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Dr. Lithius
Messages: 609
Registered: March 2005
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You just enjoy the shit out of trying to prove me wrong, don't you, Sniper? Fine. Whatever. Sure. "I play against disorganized idiots. My victories with the Chem Warrior and Sydney have all been just dumb luck. I really have no skill for the game and apparent bad taste in Infantry."
There you are. Quote that and masturbate your ego. Afterall, it's what you were aiming for, isn't it?
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| Re: Vehicles vs Infantry [message #190083 is a reply to message #190081] |
Wed, 15 February 2006 09:52 |
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Sniper_De7
Messages: 866
Registered: April 2004
Location: Wisconsin
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| Dr. Lithius wrote on Wed, 15 February 2006 10:44 |
You just enjoy the shit out of trying to prove me wrong, don't you, Sniper? Fine. Whatever. Sure. "I play against disorganized idiots. My victories with the Chem Warrior and Sydney have all been just dumb luck. I really have no skill for the game and apparent bad taste in Infantry."
There you are. Quote that and masturbate your ego. Afterall, it's what you were aiming for, isn't it?
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actually I'm just promoting tanks. If any person said SBHs/tibsydneys/chemwarriors are worth while, are just doing the opposite of what it should be. It's just you really *can't* argue against me when I say a med tank can easily get away from a chem warrior if it wanted to, and that only idiots wouldn't be able to. Therefore, no matter what statistics about 60% killing ratios, then the 40% actually had a clue to what they were doing. Maybe if you realize that the game is more about going in the back of bases and shooting at vehicles with snipers, you'll instead try and help your teammates by being effective by buying tanks.
I'm not the only one who thinks that chem warriors are useless infantry. Just because you ARE wrong doesn't mean you have to be all defensive. It's not so terrible to just admit you were wrong, and maybe, just maybe learn something from being wrong. This is the *tactics* part of the forum where if you want to learn how to play more effectively. I'm only enforcing it. Teach players to run out into the field with chem warriors and say that they're good against vehicles is just wrong. I'm just reinforcing Terminators point - that yes, a group of organized tanks will more than likely win against a team that, instead of being a team, decided to run out with chemical warriors. If you want to think that I'm personally attacking you, that's fine - But I'm not.
By the way i didn't really say that YOU sucked, i said that people who would lose to a chem warrior when they're a med tank can't possibly be good. how on Earth you thought I said you sucked because of it is beyond me
Oderint, dum metuant.
It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat. - Theodore "Teddy" Roosevelt
[Updated on: Wed, 15 February 2006 09:55] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Vehicles vs Infantry [message #190132 is a reply to message #190081] |
Wed, 15 February 2006 20:17 |
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Renerage
Messages: 1223
Registered: May 2005
Location: Hamilton ON, Canada
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General (1 Star) |
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| Dr. Lithius wrote on Wed, 15 February 2006 11:44 |
You just enjoy the shit out of trying to prove me wrong, don't you, Sniper? Fine. Whatever. Sure. "I play against disorganized idiots. My victories with the Chem Warrior and Sydney have all been just dumb luck. I really have no skill for the game and apparent bad taste in Infantry."
There you are. Quote that and masturbate your ego. Afterall, it's what you were aiming for, isn't it?
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Dont worry Lithius, me and you can sit here and KNOW to ourselves that we are right. Like you said "we have the skill, the driver was an idiot. We are imcompetant fools to think that Chem warriors wreck the shit out of tanks."
Im telling you man. Chem warriors are the way to go when your low on cash, and tanks are around. Hell, even for extra points and you dont want to waste money that bad. Ill use chem warrior of LCG or SBH or even Sniper anyday.
A pissed off noob Once said:
I DESLIKE YOU!
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| Re: Vehicles vs Infantry [message #190142 is a reply to message #189961] |
Wed, 15 February 2006 22:59 |
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terminator 101
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I am sorry people, but I don't find Chem Warrior very useful, unless you are fighting in small tunnels, or if you want to play with harvester like cat with mouse.
Chem warrior is sort of step up from flame trooper, because it much better in every way, and the only advantages that flame trooper has is that it is free and can survive a bit more hits from explosive weapons, but this advantage is not that useful anyway.
It is almost like rocket officer and gunner on GDI. There really is no reason to get Rocket Officer, because gunner is much better. But there is one difference here, while flame trooper has at least some advantages, GDI rocket officer has none.
Anyway, I think that at least the free infantry should have infinite ammo, to make it more useful.
"It is time you saw the future, while you still have human eyes"
Cheaters only Cheat themselves!
so
Hasta la vista, baby!
[Updated on: Wed, 15 February 2006 23:00] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Vehicles vs Infantry [message #190147 is a reply to message #190142] |
Wed, 15 February 2006 23:26 |
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Renerage
Messages: 1223
Registered: May 2005
Location: Hamilton ON, Canada
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| Terminator 101 wrote on Thu, 16 February 2006 00:59 |
I am sorry people, but I don't find Chem Warrior very useful, unless you are fighting in small tunnels, or if you want to play with harvester like cat with mouse.
Chem warrior is sort of step up from flame trooper, because it much better in every way, and the only advantages that flame trooper has is that it is free and can survive a bit more hits from explosive weapons, but this advantage is not that useful anyway.
It is almost like rocket officer and gunner on GDI. There really is no reason to get Rocket Officer, because gunner is much better. But there is one difference here, while flame trooper has at least some advantages, GDI rocket officer has none.
Anyway, I think that at least the free infantry should have infinite ammo, to make it more useful.
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Infinite ammo with infantry would make it unbalanced. Think about it. Raveshaw with infinite ammo. Thats insane that they never have to reload, they could minch any tank. Blah, not worth it.
A pissed off noob Once said:
I DESLIKE YOU!
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| Re: Vehicles vs Infantry [message #190148 is a reply to message #189961] |
Wed, 15 February 2006 23:27 |
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Sniper_De7
Messages: 866
Registered: April 2004
Location: Wisconsin
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Thank god he said free infantry, then
Oderint, dum metuant.
It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat. - Theodore "Teddy" Roosevelt
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| Re: Vehicles vs Infantry [message #190168 is a reply to message #189961] |
Thu, 16 February 2006 05:21 |
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Dr. Lithius
Messages: 609
Registered: March 2005
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Well, if you wanna get downright technical, all Infantry Units should have infinite ammo. That's how it worked in Tiberian Dawn, afterall. I guess there was a shortage of ammo between Tiberian Dawn and Tiberian Sun or something. :o
And I still stand by what I said. I find the Chem Sprayer more useful than the Laser Chaingun unless I'm dealing with Orcas or vehicles some good distance away. I also find Sydney to be useful in a lot of situations, thanks to her decent range and splash damage.(Except against, of course, Tiberium Mutants and Chem Sprayers. But thanks to Clan Fanatics like you, I generally don't have to worry about such things! ^_^) Don't call me a "n00b" just because of my preferences. What works for some people may not work for all people, afterall. I'm just telling you that despite what you might say, these Infantry units work for me.
That aside, I never said I don't roll out on to the field with a Mobile Artillery/MRLS Truck or Light Tank/Medium Tank from time to time. Hell, I always cruise around in Humm-Vees/Buggies on n00bstories, since it can't be demolished in two seconds by three Soldiers and a Shotgunner anymore.(Nine times out of ten, I'm usually the first person out there with an off-road vehicle, opening fire on infantry, bothering the Harvester(mostly just to freak the other team out), etc.) We were just talking about Infantry more than anything, is all.
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| Re: Vehicles vs Infantry [message #190184 is a reply to message #190168] |
Thu, 16 February 2006 09:32 |
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Renerage
Messages: 1223
Registered: May 2005
Location: Hamilton ON, Canada
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General (1 Star) |
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| Dr. Lithius wrote on Thu, 16 February 2006 07:21 |
Well, if you wanna get downright technical, all Infantry Units should have infinite ammo. That's how it worked in Tiberian Dawn, afterall. I guess there was a shortage of ammo between Tiberian Dawn and Tiberian Sun or something. 
And I still stand by what I said. I find the Chem Sprayer more useful than the Laser Chaingun unless I'm dealing with Orcas or vehicles some good distance away. I also find Sydney to be useful in a lot of situations, thanks to her decent range and splash damage.(Except against, of course, Tiberium Mutants and Chem Sprayers. But thanks to Clan Fanatics like you, I generally don't have to worry about such things! ^_^) Don't call me a "n00b" just because of my preferences. What works for some people may not work for all people, afterall. I'm just telling you that despite what you might say, these Infantry units work for me.
That aside, I never said I don't roll out on to the field with a Mobile Artillery/MRLS Truck or Light Tank/Medium Tank from time to time. Hell, I always cruise around in Humm-Vees/Buggies on n00bstories, since it can't be demolished in two seconds by three Soldiers and a Shotgunner anymore.(Nine times out of ten, I'm usually the first person out there with an off-road vehicle, opening fire on infantry, bothering the Harvester(mostly just to freak the other team out), etc.) We were just talking about Infantry more than anything, is all.
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 Well said. I agree with you 100%
A pissed off noob Once said:
I DESLIKE YOU!
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