| Okay so its not VIS (Was: Question to mappers about VIS data [message #-981888] |
Sat, 22 February 2003 05:15  |
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Isn't it possible to create a map with NO VIS/dynamic culling done, and said map will lag more than one with VIS work done, because the client has to render everything?
I'm trying to figure out why NeoSabers sniper versions of the official maps lag, and the only hypothesis I can come up with is maybe he didn't do VIS on them.
EDIT: changed subject from "modders" to "mappers"
[ February 22, 2003, 12:41: Message edited by: Blazer ]
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| Okay so its not VIS (Was: Question to mappers about VIS data [message #-981886] |
Fri, 21 February 2003 23:47  |
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I did regenerate the vis on City and Walls. I'm not sure that would cause a framerate problem, since I think those two maps have a tendency to render less then they should sometimes. On the other maps I think I left the vis untouched.
I don't know what would cause lag or a bad framerate in them. I've never really noticed bad fps in maps because I always have a bad framerate (average 10, if lucky I get 15) no matter what map I play.
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| Okay so its not VIS (Was: Question to mappers about VIS data [message #-981885] |
Sat, 22 February 2003 00:25 |
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quote:
Originally posted by aircraftkiller2001:
He did visibility rendering on them... Most of it was done by Westwood, though.
The maps won't lag. They just give ****-poor framerates.
Lag doesn't just consist of ping. Lag means to go slowly as well as delay. So framerate can be called lag too.
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| Okay so its not VIS (Was: Question to mappers about VIS data [message #-981884] |
Sat, 22 February 2003 17:40 |
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Well, here's what I have experienced. When Crimson was running the normal maps, I never experienced lag of any kind whatsoever. But now with the new maps, and nothing changed except using the new maps, I lag like crazy. The SFPS is still high, my ping is still almost 0, but for instance on walls-flying when I try to enter the side tunnel to go to the top of the mountain, I always lag/teleport back outside the ramp unless I run to the entrance and pause for a bit.
Also on top of the mountain any time I run after I stop running, my character (using 3rd person view) slides a few meters while standing still.
I'm not the only one experiencing it, there have been many, many lag complaints with the new maps, and even Crimson herself has noticed it.
Since the only thing that has changed is the use of these modified maps, I am assuming the maps are causing it somehow. I was hoping it was just a VIS problem, and NeoSaber could add VIS data to fix it, but now that we have ruled that out...I dunno what the problem is.
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| Okay so its not VIS (Was: Question to mappers about VIS data [message #-981883] |
Sat, 22 February 2003 07:37 |
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I am convinced this can't be anything to do with the frame rate of the client due to you teleporting back a few metres. Frame rate lag only makes your game jumpy, not laggy and you may experience in a flame rush. It does sound like it would be Latency but you say your ping is low which confuses the matter. The only other thing it could be is the SFPS and if there above 50 you should have no lag at all.
INFO: You can tell if a server has SFPS lag not only by looking at he value but when you use a purchase terminal, the time it takes for you to change into a character can indicate SFPS lag. If it's instant the there is little or no SFPS lag.
Is this server running in GSA or WOL Mode?
Next Tests:
- Other Servers, does this problem occur on other servers both GSA and WOL Mode?
- LAN, does this problem occur on LAN games?
- Framerate, Does the cleints framerate vary more then that of the normal version of the map?
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| Okay so its not VIS (Was: Question to mappers about VIS data [message #-981882] |
Sat, 22 February 2003 08:30 |
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What we should probably make clear is that Blazer lives at my house, and therefore IS a LAN game. He connects to my server over our local network (though he does go through the Advanced Game Listings) and the FDS reports him (and me) as a 192.168.0.* IP address.
Whatever the problem is, it appears to be something with the maps... did something change when they were exported out of LevelEdit?
Oh, and to answer your question: It's running in WOL.
[ February 22, 2003, 15:31: Message edited by: Christine Korza ]
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| Okay so its not VIS (Was: Question to mappers about VIS data [message #-981881] |
Sat, 22 February 2003 09:07 |
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I have noticed a little lag myself, but I had assumed that to be because my ISP has been acting funny since the two feet of snow dropped down on this area a few days ago.
If its a problem with the maps I don't have a clue what it is. The maps probably have less to process then the normal maps since the defenses, vehicles, and beacons are gone. I don't know if something could have changed on export. I did compress the textures from .tga to .dds on some of the maps, but not all.
On a side note. I'm working on a new version of Walls_Sniping. It fixes a few vis errors. If I'm right the new version and the old version would be compatable.
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| Okay so its not VIS (Was: Question to mappers about VIS data [message #-981880] |
Sat, 22 February 2003 09:13 |
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Is this server public meaning it can be seen by other people on the internet (on WOL)?
What connection do all your PC's have and how are they connected to the internet?
I know thse questions may seem not related but they might just help solve the problem. I have come up with an idea but i'll need the answers to the questions first.
[ February 22, 2003, 16:32: Message edited by: General Havoc ]
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| Okay so its not VIS (Was: Question to mappers about VIS data [message #-981878] |
Sat, 22 February 2003 10:00 |
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quote:
Originally posted by General Havoc:
Is this server public meaning it can be seen by other people on the internet (on WOL)?
What connection do all your PC's have and how are they connected to the internet?
I know thse questions may seem not related but they might just help solve the problem. I have come up with an idea but i'll need the answers to the questions first.
code:
Internet <--> CableModem<->CrimmysPC NIC #1.(public IP)
100mbit Hub<->CrimmysPC NIC #2.(192.168.0.1)
^ ^----<->Renegade Server..(192.168.0.x)
|______<->Other PCs........(192.168.0.x)
Her computer is runing ICS and is the gateway for the other PCs. Nothing with this setup changed at or around the time of the map change.
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| Okay so its not VIS (Was: Question to mappers about VIS data [message #-981875] |
Sat, 22 February 2003 19:23 |
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quote:
Originally posted by Blazer:
Well, here's what I have experienced. When Crimson was running the normal maps, I never experienced lag of any kind whatsoever. But now with the new maps, and nothing changed except using the new maps, I lag like crazy. The SFPS is still high, my ping is still almost 0, but for instance on walls-flying when I try to enter the side tunnel to go to the top of the mountain, I always lag/teleport back outside the ramp unless I run to the entrance and pause for a bit.
Also on top of the mountain any time I run after I stop running, my character (using 3rd person view) slides a few meters while standing still.
I'm not the only one experiencing it, there have been many, many lag complaints with the new maps, and even Crimson herself has noticed it.
Since the only thing that has changed is the use of these modified maps, I am assuming the maps are causing it somehow. I was hoping it was just a VIS problem, and NeoSaber could add VIS data to fix it, but now that we have ruled that out...I dunno what the problem is.
When I played the maps I noticed my FPS dropped from 70 to 30.
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| Okay so its not VIS (Was: Question to mappers about VIS data [message #-981874] |
Sat, 22 February 2003 19:48 |
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I can see where your lag can be coming from i know it may sound strange but i think your lag will go if you tested these maps on someone elses server.
It's to do with your setup to the internet, i know you say you had no lag before, that is what makes my theory questionable. Basically what you think is happening is indeed not.
The FDS is running on PC3 in WOL mode, meaning that you CANNOT make a LAN connection to the game, it will always be a net connection.
This means PC1 and PC2 are actually using the server IP and the servers bandwidth to connect to the server not your LAN's, i.e they join the game over the internet, not your LAN. As far as i know you can't use your lan IP to join an internet server. Your ping will be 0 as your sending data back to yourself.
It's a bit hard to understand what i'm going on about, someone else may know but this is the only think i can think causeing the lag.
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| Okay so its not VIS (Was: Question to mappers about VIS data [message #-981873] |
Sat, 22 February 2003 22:35 |
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quote:
Originally posted by General Havoc:
The FDS is running on PC3 in WOL mode, meaning that you CANNOT make a LAN connection to the game, it will always be a net connection.
This means PC1 and PC2 are actually using the server IP and the servers bandwidth to connect to the server not your LAN's, i.e they join the game over the internet, not your LAN. As far as i know you can't use your lan IP to join an internet server. Your ping will be 0 as your sending data back to yourself.
It's a bit hard to understand what i'm going on about, someone else may know but this is the only think i can think causeing the lag.
Wrong. I connect in LAN mode via +connect. My packets go directly through the 100mbit hub to the server, NOT out to the internet and back again. I have always connected this way, and never had a problem until the map change, at which point everyone also noticed problems...why is everyone so quick to dismiss the obvious and say it is user error ![[Razz]](tongue.gif)
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| Okay so its not VIS (Was: Question to mappers about VIS data [message #-981871] |
Sun, 23 February 2003 01:04 |
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I'm still not convinced it is the maps. For me, the lag got worse as time went on. In the first few days it was non existent, but as the days went on it got to the point that I couldn't maintain a connection for more then five minutes. The maps didn't change during the week, so they couldn't have been making the lag worse.
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