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how many renegade players have died in real life?
I think it's amusing knowing that when I die one day (probably in a drive-by shooting) that, among other things, i'm going to be leaving behind meaningless posts on the renegade forums. There are others who have died and it's always surreal to see their left-behind forum posts and all that. Can you name or remember any players who have died irl that played renegade? I vaguely recall someone named Trey/dom dying when I was first playing renegade, and I was essentially a little kid then and remember how weird it was realizing someone had died from ren. Anyone else? edit: some others i remember now: spoonplex nfekti0n (spelling?) Gunny
Re: how many renegade players have died in real life?
Spoonplex edit: was Spoonplex a recent one? this year went by fast so i dont know
Didnt RC22fires pass away recently? No offense to anyone that knew him. If only there were respawns..
Spoonplex and HTGunny are the only ones I can remember. I know there are others but they don't pop into my head at the moment, sadly... Edit: techman06 is another I remember. I believe he comitted suicide. It sucks thinking about this stuff, but I guess you would never think people who play ren would just suddenly not come back online anymore.
Xpert wrote on Tue, 26 October 2010 19:27 Spoonplex and HTGunny are the only ones I can remember. I know there are others but they don't pop into my head at the moment, sadly... Edit: techman06 is another I remember. I believe he comitted suicide. It sucks thinking about this stuff, but I guess you would never think people who play ren would just suddenly not come back online anymore. No way, seriously? When did this happen?
nfekti0n committed suicide.
z310 wrote on Tue, 26 October 2010 20:17 Mindtzar died of a drug OD. Seriously? I did not know this... :\
z310 wrote on Tue, 26 October 2010 23:17 Mindtzar died of a drug OD. Are you serious? Please provide more information. =o
The problem is a lot of people may have died over the years and there has been no communication of it to the communities that the people belonged too. I know that if I got hit by a bus tomorrow and died my family wouldn't even think to let people on renegade know haha.
Has been for some time.
Oblivion165 wrote on Wed, 27 October 2010 18:24 Holy crap Gunny is dead?? That's crazy. Ya there was this whole thing at this old community called "LTROUSH CTF" and there was a siggy made in her memory and a lot of us used it. It's been over 4 years now I believe since her passing. Died of cancer. Young age too, I think 23? Can't remember exactly.
z310 wrote on Tue, 26 October 2010 22:17 Mindtzar died of a drug OD. Wow I didn't know this either... I was just thinking about him lately... Wanting to send him a message.
Xpert wrote on Thu, 28 October 2010 07:41 "LTROUSH CTF" god dam, that was a sick server...
Hmm, judging by these posts, Renegade players are more likely to die by suicide than non-renegade players
Man I had no idea about techman06...........
JohnDoe wrote on Thu, 28 October 2010 10:44 notice how good players dont die no disrespect but that sounded like an insult to the players that have passed..
EvilWhiteDragon wrote on Thu, 28 October 2010 12:00 Hmm, judging by these posts, Renegade players are more likely to die by suicide than non-renegade players I imagine that a lot of people drawn toward online videogames are more likely to be depressed or have some anti-social issues
Rocko wrote on Thu, 28 October 2010 14:43 EvilWhiteDragon wrote on Thu, 28 October 2010 12:00 Hmm, judging by these posts, Renegade players are more likely to die by suicide than non-renegade players I imagine that a lot of people drawn toward online videogames are more likely to be depressed or have some anti-social issues Thats illogical, if that were the case then WoW would be out of players by now But seriously, to think someone could die of cancer at age 23, thats horrible.
http://www.funkylist.com/ViewList.aspx?id=217&name=A+list+of+video+games+tha t+people+have+died+playing this one is pretty sad: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Video_game_addiction#South_Korea humans are social creatures and video game addiction take people away from their social life (at least partially), and this causes an abnormality which could result in an instant and unexpected death. if you ask me, doomsday could be near.
archerman wrote on Sun, 31 October 2010 02:32 if you ask me, doomsday could be near. Good thing nobody asked you (Or cares what the Turks think).
Dover wrote on Sun, 31 October 2010 09:48 archerman wrote on Sun, 31 October 2010 02:32 if you ask me, doomsday could be near. Good thing nobody asked you (Or cares what the Turks think). Keep your racism, and ad hominem, to yourself. Verbal warning.
(SSnipe) -BLU3Y3Z- wrote on Thu, 28 October 2010 12:51 JohnDoe wrote on Thu, 28 October 2010 10:44 notice how good players dont die no disrespect but that sounded like an insult to the players that have passed.. I have not heard anyone that I personally came across through Renegade or any other online game or forum has passed away. But I have certainly read a lot of threads and heard a lot of others talk about players that have passed. Mainly Spoonplex from Jelly. From what I have read, I would definitely say you need to retract your troll statement, and probably just keep quiet. If there were any decency in you, you would apologize... actually if there were any in you, you would not have made such a statement in the first place. Sadly, it is the trolls that seem not to die. Maybe they do, but nobody misses them. The people mentioned in this thread by others may have not have been the best players, but I am sure they were still worth more than you. You seek attention while you are alive, maybe you already know when your time comes... nobody will care, or miss you. Kinda sad to be jealous of people who have passed.
JohnDoe wrote on Thu, 28 October 2010 12:44 notice how good players dont die That's kind've a dick thing to say, even for a trollish statement.
CarrierII wrote on Sun, 31 October 2010 05:26 Dover wrote on Sun, 31 October 2010 09:48 archerman wrote on Sun, 31 October 2010 02:32 if you ask me, doomsday could be near. Good thing nobody asked you (Or cares what the Turks think). Keep your racism, and ad hominem, to yourself. Verbal warning. Are we really going to pretend he isn't asking for it? Playing Dr. Phil and talking about abnormalities that cause instant death? And then doomsday is near?! Isn't there a max level of bullshit allowed in a single post? As for racism, I can look past the Armenian genocide and the Batak massacre and all the other Turkish abuses, but archerman isn't exactly giving his people a good name. Notice how half his postcount disapeared after the spam fest wipe?
reborn wrote on Wed, 27 October 2010 01:27 z310 wrote on Tue, 26 October 2010 23:17 Mindtzar died of a drug OD. Are you serious? Please provide more information. =o Quote: --- Day changed Wed Oct 20 2010 ... <@pseudo> went to high school with him <@pseudo> got way too into drugs <@pseudo> the stupid thing is <@pseudo> of his group of drug buddies <@pseudo> he was the sensible one <@pseudo> after he died one of them went full on junkie <@JamesG> how long ago was that? <@pseudo> 2 years <@pseudo> he died about this time <@pseudo> in 2008 <@pseudo> i remember because it was my first week of university <@pseudo> and I saw the ambulance when I was walking home <@pseudo> and I was like "yep, mark's probably dead" It was brought up again recently. I cut some stuff out of the logs. He ODed on heroin.
Dover wrote on Mon, 01 November 2010 00:20 CarrierII wrote on Sun, 31 October 2010 05:26 Dover wrote on Sun, 31 October 2010 09:48 archerman wrote on Sun, 31 October 2010 02:32 if you ask me, doomsday could be near. Good thing nobody asked you (Or cares what the Turks think). Keep your racism, and ad hominem, to yourself. Verbal warning. Are we really going to pretend he isn't asking for it? Playing Dr. Phil and talking about abnormalities that cause instant death? And then doomsday is near?! Isn't there a max level of bullshit allowed in a single post? As for racism, I can look past the Armenian genocide and the Batak massacre and all the other Turkish abuses, but archerman isn't exactly giving his people a good name. Notice how half his postcount disapeared after the spam fest wipe? He doesn't nessecarily condone those acts, regardless of the number of posts he lost, there's no need to respond to his nonsense statements, he may stop making them if we (read: you) stop responding.
Chew wrote on Sun, 31 October 2010 14:42 (SSnipe) -BLU3Y3Z- wrote on Thu, 28 October 2010 12:51 JohnDoe wrote on Thu, 28 October 2010 10:44 notice how good players dont die no disrespect but that sounded like an insult to the players that have passed.. I have not heard anyone that I personally came across through Renegade or any other online game or forum has passed away. But I have certainly read a lot of threads and heard a lot of others talk about players that have passed. Mainly Spoonplex from Jelly. From what I have read, I would definitely say you need to retract your troll statement, and probably just keep quiet. If there were any decency in you, you would apologize... actually if there were any in you, you would not have made such a statement in the first place. Sadly, it is the trolls that seem not to die. Maybe they do, but nobody misses them. The people mentioned in this thread by others may have not have been the best players, but I am sure they were still worth more than you. You seek attention while you are alive, maybe you already know when your time comes... nobody will care, or miss you. Kinda sad to be jealous of people who have passed. god won't smite me, he loves watching me play renegade
JohnDoe wrote on Mon, 01 November 2010 12:07 god won't smite me, he loves watching me play renegade God grew tired of smiting us quite a while ago, he's working on a new project (explosive hentia) to deal with us... However we are completely derailed now, trollz gonna troll, ignore them and lets get back on topic please.
hmmm, mindzard i didn't knew he passed away at all. That is a shame, he was one of the smart guys back in the days when i was a imature player. rip
One of the first ones I knew of was Trey Dornieden of the Dominion Guild. http://www.renegadeforums.com/index.php?t=msg&goto=23763&rid=110
z310 wrote on Mon, 01 November 2010 04:46 reborn wrote on Wed, 27 October 2010 01:27 z310 wrote on Tue, 26 October 2010 23:17 Mindtzar died of a drug OD. Are you serious? Please provide more information. =o Quote: --- Day changed Wed Oct 20 2010 ... <@pseudo> went to high school with him <@pseudo> got way too into drugs <@pseudo> the stupid thing is <@pseudo> of his group of drug buddies <@pseudo> he was the sensible one <@pseudo> after he died one of them went full on junkie <@JamesG> how long ago was that? <@pseudo> 2 years <@pseudo> he died about this time <@pseudo> in 2008 <@pseudo> i remember because it was my first week of university <@pseudo> and I saw the ambulance when I was walking home <@pseudo> and I was like "yep, mark's probably dead" It was brought up again recently. I cut some stuff out of the logs. He ODed on heroin. Are you sure we aren't talking about a different Mark? Mindtzar lived in the UK and last I had talked to him still lived there. Pseudo is from California. It seems rather odd to me that they could have gone to high school together.
Dover wrote on Sun, 31 October 2010 19:20 I have no respect for those mourning. Show some fucking respect and not derail every single thread for your stupid prejudice. You're worse than John Doe for saying that, even.
to be fair, people are mourning random drug ods itt
JohnDoe wrote on Tue, 02 November 2010 19:09 to be fair, people are mourning random drug ods itt Not exactly mourning, but still should show some respect, and not all passed by OD's... to be fair.
z310 wrote on Mon, 01 November 2010 18:38 This is a different pseudo. Ah shoot... :/ I was really hoping it was a mix up.
this wasnt necessarily a mourning RIP all da homies kind of topic. just trying find out what people have died on renegade and how everyone is affected by it.
how many renegade players have died in real life? not nearly enough.
trooprm02 wrote on Thu, 04 November 2010 12:40 how many renegade players have died in real life? not nearly enough. We are all wondering why you are still here...
Chew wrote on Thu, 04 November 2010 13:19 trooprm02 wrote on Thu, 04 November 2010 12:40 how many renegade players have died in real life? not nearly enough. We are all wondering why you are still here... JohnDoe wrote on Thu, 28 October 2010 12:44 notice how good players dont die Does that answer your question? Meanwhile, you fit better into my category
To put it in a blunt perspective, many could of easily died and we've just assumed they've stopped playing due to moving on, etc.
trooprm02 wrote on Thu, 04 November 2010 16:44 Chew wrote on Thu, 04 November 2010 13:19 trooprm02 wrote on Thu, 04 November 2010 12:40 how many renegade players have died in real life? not nearly enough. We are all wondering why you are still here... JohnDoe wrote on Thu, 28 October 2010 12:44 notice how good players dont die Does that answer your question? Meanwhile, you fit better into my category Yes, you 2 would agree... seeing how you both think you are the best Renegade players ever... I wonder who would win or dodge, you should 1v1 him... lols. I wonder if you guys even know how stupid you guys sound sometimes.
Chew wrote on Thu, 04 November 2010 18:49 I wonder if you guys even know how stupid you guys sound sometimes. The irony in this post almost made my PC bluescreen....
Hurr durr, and then Dover is being disrespectful for calling faggots out on being faggots, right?
Dover wrote on Fri, 05 November 2010 11:53 Hurr durr, and then Dover is being disrespectful for calling faggots out on being faggots, right? Are you this disrespectful at funerals? Mere curiosity... Edit: Before you go all "HURR DURR THIS ISN'T A FUNERAL", just consider the question as an intellectual exercise would you. In short: Weren't you ever taught to respect the dead?
CarrierII wrote on Fri, 05 November 2010 05:05 Dover wrote on Fri, 05 November 2010 11:53 Hurr durr, and then Dover is being disrespectful for calling faggots out on being faggots, right? Are you this disrespectful at funerals? Mere curiosity... Edit: Before you go all "HURR DURR THIS ISN'T A FUNERAL", just consider the question as an intellectual exercise would you. In short: Weren't you ever taught to respect the dead? Nowhere in this thread do I disrespect the dead, Carrier. Only Archerman. Unless he's keeled over in the meantime, I don't see the connection. Aside from the posts being loaded on the same page, which is trivial at best. You might as well call a bar that opens on the same street as a graveyard a disrespect to the dead, dispite not involving them in any way.
Glock wrote on Tue, 02 November 2010 01:23 Dover wrote on Sun, 31 October 2010 19:20 I have no respect for those mourning. Show some fucking respect and not derail every single thread for your stupid prejudice. You're worse than John Doe for saying that, even. ^
CarrierII wrote on Sat, 06 November 2010 11:08 Glock wrote on Tue, 02 November 2010 01:23 Dover wrote on Sun, 31 October 2010 19:20 I have no respect for those mourning. Show some fucking respect and not derail every single thread for your stupid prejudice. You're worse than John Doe for saying that, even. ^ I shouldn't have to tell you that I never actually wrote "I have no respect for the mourning", and that was just Glock thinking he's being clever with editing quotes, right?
Quote: how many renegade players have died in real life? JohnDoe wrote on Thu, 28 October 2010 13:44 notice how good players dont die Dover wrote on Sun, 31 October 2010 05:48 archerman wrote on Sun, 31 October 2010 02:32 http://www.funkylist.com/ViewList.aspx?id=217&name=A+list+of+video+games+tha t+people+have+died+playing this one is pretty sad: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Video_game_addiction#South_Korea humans are social creatures and video game addiction take people away from their social life (at least partially), and this causes an abnormality which could result in an instant and unexpected death. if you ask me, doomsday could be near. Good thing nobody asked you (Or cares what the Turks think). EvilWhiteDragon wrote on Thu, 28 October 2010 13:00 Hmm, judging by these posts, Renegade players are more likely to die by suicide than non-renegade players Cause and effect, maybe?
Dover wrote on Sun, 07 November 2010 01:58 CarrierII wrote on Sat, 06 November 2010 11:08 Glock wrote on Tue, 02 November 2010 01:23 Dover wrote on Sun, 31 October 2010 19:20 I have no respect for those mourning. Show some fucking respect and not derail every single thread for your stupid prejudice. You're worse than John Doe for saying that, even. ^ I shouldn't have to tell you that I never actually wrote "I have no respect for the mourning", and that was just Glock thinking he's being clever with editing quotes, right? The quoted post had been edited, so I assumed you'd since removed the line quoted. My mistake.
Hero was shipped off to the middle east a year or so back (Air Force or Navy can't remember) and still no word from him even though he said he would have access to internet. For those of you who don't know he made that Hero's Pro Circuit Race Map...among others.
there was a story that turned up on n00bstories that seemed a little far-fetched, but... this guy MVPguy supposedly committed suicide cos he thought people on the internet were stalking him. if someone really had psychological disorders it could be true, i can certainly imagine tildeth or null going out that way
Tildeth wont commit suicide, he's too cool for suicide. He's a funny guy.
I wouldn't doubt it with his bipolar disorder... lol that guy is the angriest person I have ever met
Yeah his transition from regular typing to CAPS was second to none
it was obvious he was seriously mentally deteriorating...
I don't know why suicides are instantly deemed to be selfish? Why?
Starbuzzz wrote on Sat, 13 November 2010 11:45 I don't know why suicides are instantly deemed to be selfish? Why?
argathol3 wrote on Thu, 11 November 2010 07:58 Hero was shipped off to the middle east a year or so back (Air Force or Navy can't remember) and still no word from him even though he said he would have access to internet. For those of you who don't know he made that Hero's Pro Circuit Race Map...among others. dude's just fine, i talked to him in the last 2 weeks Quote: [15:22:10] <&JellyAOW1> [BR] hero2112 was last seen on this server 1 weeks 6 days 22 hours 46 minutes and 60 seconds ago what about murder193 who got shipped off to iraq and stole valium or something from iraqui doctors and hasn't been heard from since people like to say suicide is selfish because it hurts the feelings of those who lose the ones they care about maybe it's selfish asking someone suffering enough to want to end their lives to stick around just to make those people feel better, i don't know
bmr_71 wrote on Tue, 16 November 2010 15:22 to answer OP, not enough Would you like a ban for posting insensitive messages, or one word posts? If not, STOP. This is a formal warning.
Starbuzzz wrote on Sat, 13 November 2010 11:45 I don't know why suicides are instantly deemed to be selfish? Why? Because no matter your issue there's always help for every instance no matter how serious. You kill yourself and it leaves your family and friends wondering that maybe they could have helped you and then that evolves into those people ending up blaming themselves for not being more active in said persons life. When you walk into your lifetime friends room and see him hanging from a rope you'll know what I know.
argathol3 wrote on Wed, 17 November 2010 14:28 Starbuzzz wrote on Sat, 13 November 2010 11:45 I don't know why suicides are instantly deemed to be selfish? Why? Because no matter your issue there's always help for every instance no matter how serious. You kill yourself and it leaves your family and friends wondering that maybe they could have helped you and then that evolves into those people ending up blaming themselves for not being more active in said persons life. When you walk into your lifetime friends room and see him hanging from a rope you'll know what I know. david carradine?
CarrierII wrote on Wed, 17 November 2010 13:45 bmr_71 wrote on Tue, 16 November 2010 15:22 to answer OP, not enough Would you like a ban for posting insensitive messages, or one word posts? If not, STOP. This is a formal warning. boomer always trolls ban him
bmr_71 wrote on Tue, 16 November 2010 10:22 to answer OP, not enough Whoops, I meant to put that on another thread. Still, I am very sorry. I hope I didn't hurt anybody by what I said.
JohnDoe wrote on Fri, 19 November 2010 15:34 CarrierII wrote on Wed, 17 November 2010 13:45 bmr_71 wrote on Tue, 16 November 2010 15:22 to answer OP, not enough Would you like a ban for posting insensitive messages, or one word posts? If not, STOP. This is a formal warning. boomer always trolls ban him You seem like a pretty nice guy. Why are you so mean today ? lol!
Dover wrote on Mon, 01 November 2010 01:20 CarrierII wrote on Sun, 31 October 2010 05:26 Dover wrote on Sun, 31 October 2010 09:48 archerman wrote on Sun, 31 October 2010 02:32 if you ask me, doomsday could be near. Good thing nobody asked you (Or cares what the Turks think). Keep your racism, and ad hominem, to yourself. Verbal warning. Are we really going to pretend he isn't asking for it? Playing Dr. Phil and talking about abnormalities that cause instant death? And then doomsday is near?! Isn't there a max level of bullshit allowed in a single post? As for racism, I can look past the Armenian genocide and the Batak massacre and all the other Turkish abuses, but archerman isn't exactly giving his people a good name. Notice how half his postcount disapeared after the spam fest wipe? Don't pretend the USA is much better, come on. You should be among the last of all people to complain.
R315r4z0r wrote on Sun, 07 November 2010 04:43 Quote: how many renegade players have died in real life? JohnDoe wrote on Thu, 28 October 2010 13:44 notice how good players dont die Dover wrote on Sun, 31 October 2010 05:48 archerman wrote on Sun, 31 October 2010 02:32 http://www.funkylist.com/ViewList.aspx?id=217&name=A+list+of+video+games+tha t+people+have+died+playing this one is pretty sad: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Video_game_addiction#South_Korea humans are social creatures and video game addiction take people away from their social life (at least partially), and this causes an abnormality which could result in an instant and unexpected death. if you ask me, doomsday could be near. Good thing nobody asked you (Or cares what the Turks think). EvilWhiteDragon wrote on Thu, 28 October 2010 13:00 Hmm, judging by these posts, Renegade players are more likely to die by suicide than non-renegade players Cause and effect, maybe? At the least one can find a good reason why so many Renegade players committed suicide. If I wouldn't be my positive self, I would've killed myself after visiting these forums for all these years. Although I must admit, the stupidity here does make me a bit sad, every time I visit.
cmatt42 wrote on Wed, 27 October 2010 19:43 Bloodmoss passed away recently. What?! No way!
EvilWhiteDragon wrote on Wed, 24 November 2010 10:36 Dover wrote on Mon, 01 November 2010 01:20 CarrierII wrote on Sun, 31 October 2010 05:26 Dover wrote on Sun, 31 October 2010 09:48 archerman wrote on Sun, 31 October 2010 02:32 if you ask me, doomsday could be near. Good thing nobody asked you (Or cares what the Turks think). Keep your racism, and ad hominem, to yourself. Verbal warning. Are we really going to pretend he isn't asking for it? Playing Dr. Phil and talking about abnormalities that cause instant death? And then doomsday is near?! Isn't there a max level of bullshit allowed in a single post? As for racism, I can look past the Armenian genocide and the Batak massacre and all the other Turkish abuses, but archerman isn't exactly giving his people a good name. Notice how half his postcount disapeared after the spam fest wipe? Don't pretend the USA is much better, come on. You should be among the last of all people to complain. Of course not, but what the US does so well that Turkey utterly fails at is admitting their mistakes. We know our slavery phase was wrong and we can own up to it. We can look back on our imperialism phase and have a meaningful discussion on the negatives. Turkey, on the other hand still wants to pretend that the Armenian genocide never happened, that the Janissarys were all volunteers. It's like having a country full of halocaust deniers. Every nation, almost without exception, has some historical skeletons in their closet that they're not proud of. It's how you deal with them afterwards that reveals character.
Dover wrote on Sat, 27 November 2010 23:55 Of course not, but what the US does so well that Turkey utterly fails at is admitting their mistakes. To be fair, most countries rarely admit their mistakes. I think the USA is about the only one to, although we go about it the wrong way... Dover wrote on Sat, 27 November 2010 23: We know our slavery phase was wrong and we can own up to it. Only some of the intellectuals (of which, there aren't many of). Most people just feel "white guilt" about it, but don't really own up to it. Dover wrote on Sat, 27 November 2010 23:55 We can look back on our imperialism phase and have a meaningful discussion on the negatives. A lot of the US, if asked what their opinion on slavery was, would say "Slavery was BAD and it should have NEVER happened". I don't think anyone actually gets WHY it's bad; they just say it's bad. They're not wrong, but they're hardly capable of having a "meaningful discussion". Dover wrote on Sat, 27 November 2010 23:55 Every nation, almost without exception, has some historical skeletons in their closet that they're not proud of. It's how you deal with them afterwards that reveals character. It's not like the US has dealt with its problems very well, either. If you try and actually discuss why slavery was bad, all you can do is preach to the choir. "Slavery was so stupid, man!" etc, unless you want to be labeled as a racist and a slave driver. I don't really call that a meaningful discussion.
Dover wrote on Sun, 28 November 2010 06:55 EvilWhiteDragon wrote on Wed, 24 November 2010 10:36 Dover wrote on Mon, 01 November 2010 01:20 CarrierII wrote on Sun, 31 October 2010 05:26 Dover wrote on Sun, 31 October 2010 09:48 archerman wrote on Sun, 31 October 2010 02:32 if you ask me, doomsday could be near. Good thing nobody asked you (Or cares what the Turks think). Keep your racism, and ad hominem, to yourself. Verbal warning. Are we really going to pretend he isn't asking for it? Playing Dr. Phil and talking about abnormalities that cause instant death? And then doomsday is near?! Isn't there a max level of bullshit allowed in a single post? As for racism, I can look past the Armenian genocide and the Batak massacre and all the other Turkish abuses, but archerman isn't exactly giving his people a good name. Notice how half his postcount disapeared after the spam fest wipe? Don't pretend the USA is much better, come on. You should be among the last of all people to complain. Of course not, but what the US does so well that Turkey utterly fails at is admitting their mistakes. We know our slavery phase was wrong and we can own up to it. We can look back on our imperialism phase and have a meaningful discussion on the negatives. Turkey, on the other hand still wants to pretend that the Armenian genocide never happened, that the Janissarys were all volunteers. It's like having a country full of halocaust deniers. Every nation, almost without exception, has some historical skeletons in their closet that they're not proud of. It's how you deal with them afterwards that reveals character. I know this will be a sensitive subject, but what about Iraq? I have never heard an American official say that they were really wrong in invading Iraq. They might have admitted that the reason (WMD's) might have been wrong, but then they claim it was for freedom and what not more. I could believe that, if the USA didn't have such a record of working with dictators that liked the USA. Oh, and then the bodies that came out of the wikileaks closet... Afaik the USA has been hammering on the fact that the leaks are illegal, and not providing excuses for the wrongdoings described in them. Now, I'm not saying the Netherlands (or the EU for that matter) is a lot better, perhaps it is, perhaps it's not. But I think it's wrong to blame countries for their stubbornness not to admit their mistakes, as there are virtually no countries that are willing to go that way, all the way. If one does, that country should be praised, if one does not, then I guess that's pretty much human nature.
GEORGE ZIMMER wrote on Sun, 28 November 2010 12:04 Dover wrote on Sat, 27 November 2010 23:55 Of course not, but what the US does so well that Turkey utterly fails at is admitting their mistakes. To be fair, most countries rarely admit their mistakes. I think the USA is about the only one to, although we go about it the wrong way... lol especially funny considering what holiday was observed in the usa just a few days ago
How did we get slavery and Iraq out of dead Renegade players? Anyway, I feel no "white" guilt about slavery, nor reverse racism towards blacks. Any idea why? I don't own slaves. My family didn't own slaves. They were jewelers from Germany who came here to branch out a business. Protip: For added rage, when someone pulls the race card or otherwise guilts you on your ancestors, tell them "your forefathers didn't have the qualifications my forefathers were looking for."
JohnDoe wrote on Sun, 28 November 2010 08:49 george zimmer is like a trolling boomer he's pretty lame though, he's all like POLITIKZ wheras i'm more like 4CHANN ya know
ya his serious posts read like your troll posts
EvilWhiteDragon wrote on Sun, 28 November 2010 07:02 They might have admitted that the reason (WMD's) might have been wrong, but then they claim it was for freedom and what not more. I could believe that, if the USA didn't have such a record of working with dictators that liked the USA. i'm not sure i understand your point here, isn't it a good thing that the US finally decided to side with democratic movements against dictators? it certainly has a record of siding with dictators - including saddam himself - it's about fucking time that policy was reversed, isn't it?
GEORGE ZIMMER wrote on Sun, 28 November 2010 03:04 Dover wrote on Sat, 27 November 2010 23:55 Of course not, but what the US does so well that Turkey utterly fails at is admitting their mistakes. To be fair, most countries rarely admit their mistakes. I think the USA is about the only one to, although we go about it the wrong way... Dover wrote on Sat, 27 November 2010 23: We know our slavery phase was wrong and we can own up to it. Only some of the intellectuals (of which, there aren't many of). Most people just feel "white guilt" about it, but don't really own up to it. Dover wrote on Sat, 27 November 2010 23:55 We can look back on our imperialism phase and have a meaningful discussion on the negatives. A lot of the US, if asked what their opinion on slavery was, would say "Slavery was BAD and it should have NEVER happened". I don't think anyone actually gets WHY it's bad; they just say it's bad. They're not wrong, but they're hardly capable of having a "meaningful discussion". Dover wrote on Sat, 27 November 2010 23:55 Every nation, almost without exception, has some historical skeletons in their closet that they're not proud of. It's how you deal with them afterwards that reveals character. It's not like the US has dealt with its problems very well, either. If you try and actually discuss why slavery was bad, all you can do is preach to the choir. "Slavery was so stupid, man!" etc, unless you want to be labeled as a racist and a slave driver. I don't really call that a meaningful discussion. There's a fine but meaningful line between "Slavery was wrong and should never have happened" and "Slavery never happened". I would see a Turk saying "The Batak masacare was wrong and should never have happened" as a step in the right direction.
JohnDoe wrote on Wed, 01 December 2010 11:10 ya his serious posts read like your troll posts ?