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C&C: Renegade --> Dying since 2003™, resurrected in 2024!
Hello everyone! A new clan is born! Its name is United Anti-Cheating Federation [UACF]! We are 10 members big now: [UACF]kuck [UACF]andy [UACF]LeTz [UACF]ghost [UACF]hypn0 [UACF]dark [UACF]blade [UACF]won [UACF]crazy [UACF]Leiw Like our clan name says, we are strict against cheating or bug-using of any kind. It's time for an Anti Cheating Federation, that's the reason why we've founded one. If you want to join us, be allies with us or just check us out, join our server or say hello on our forum: *click*!! See you, Léiw.
Uhhh... its called renguard?
lol, no it's not called Renguard, we're fighting against cheaters.
lol, I won't post a cheater list here, that would be too much, I'm doing my best to make a known-cheater list, but it's really hard work because you have to be sure that they cheat, not only put them in your list because they owned you or whatever. Give it a try and make your own cheater list
I'm going to go empty my pool with a spoon.
mrpirate wrote on Tue, 11 July 2006 23:25 I'm going to go empty my pool with a spoon. Bahaha!
mrpirate wrote on Tue, 11 July 2006 17:25 I'm going to go empty my pool with a spoon. I'm on my way.
HOW DO YOU FIGHT A CHEATER? THEY USE 1337 HAX AND OWN U LOL!?
I don't care if you gave up the fairplay, but we didn't. At least we're doing something, the only thing your doing is to complain about cheating but not doing a sh*t.
Leiw wrote on Thu, 13 July 2006 14:39 I don't care if you gave up the fairplay, but we didn't. At least we're doing something, the only thing your doing is to complain about cheating but not doing a sh*t. um, I'm in charge of a clanwar league (in fact, I think it might be the only Renegade clanwar league) in which cheating warrants an indefinite ban on the first offence, so yeah. Result: no cheating at all in clan games. Shame you can't say that about public servers. What have you done? Oh yeah, make a list of names. That's helpful.
Yeah, we're making a known-cheater list too, we already got aroung 70 nicks and 110 ips, still working on it, I'll tell you when it's finished, perhaps that's the only way we can do something.
Leiw wrote on Fri, 14 July 2006 10:38 Yeah, we're making a known-cheater list too, we already got aroung 70 nicks and 110 ips, still working on it, I'll tell you when it's finished, perhaps that's the only way we can do something. I got more cheaters banned off my server, though. Maiden, how do you know if someone was/is cheating or not? At the moment no tests are valid anymore, theer are enough cheats that you simply cannot spot on screenshots or during a test. Even if you would ban someone, they could join back in your league as easy as they could join back in a public server. So how is keeping cheats out of your league so different compared to keeping cheats out of a public server? You don't even have a more or less impartial person in the game during the clan wars as one team will say they cheat and the other says they don't. Just to show i find "Result: no cheating at all in clan games" a bit weird. Maybe "no catching cheaters in clan wars" would be a more appropriate statement (meaning at least they need to be careful about which cheat they use).
Of course you got more cheaters banned on thekoss2 than on our server because our server is running since 1 week...
And 90% of the people on their ban list don't even cheat.
On our banlist are 100% cheaters, known-cheaters. They use final, wallhacks, or damage hacks. The one we tested and banned were using bighead. We really take care that good players don't come in our list. So you don't have to worry
Leiw wrote on Fri, 14 July 2006 13:19 Of course you got more cheaters banned on thekoss2 I was referring to this comment.
Ah, ok. Well at my mind TheKoss2 are experienced rene-players and they won't ban without being sure that someone cheats. Even if their swearing rules are a bit strange
Goztow wrote on Fri, 14 July 2006 11:25 Leiw wrote on Fri, 14 July 2006 10:38 Yeah, we're making a known-cheater list too, we already got aroung 70 nicks and 110 ips, still working on it, I'll tell you when it's finished, perhaps that's the only way we can do something. I got more cheaters banned off my server, though. Maiden, how do you know if someone was/is cheating or not? At the moment no tests are valid anymore, theer are enough cheats that you simply cannot spot on screenshots or during a test. Even if you would ban someone, they could join back in your league as easy as they could join back in a public server. So how is keeping cheats out of your league so different compared to keeping cheats out of a public server? You don't even have a more or less impartial person in the game during the clan wars as one team will say they cheat and the other says they don't. Just to show i find "Result: no cheating at all in clan games" a bit weird. Maybe "no catching cheaters in clan wars" would be a more appropriate statement (meaning at least they need to be careful about which cheat they use). I think this is where common sense comes into mind, you do have to allow for lag etc, and for the fact that players with nicks not known to you might actually be better than you. Its all about skill, and some people just can't take the fact there are better players out there than them. I know for a fact that no one will play GW without RG, even with that everyone thinks we cheat. IT gets to a point where we get tired of defending ourselves against clans( I know that just about all GSA clans think we cheat, i suspect that WOL clans such as Koss2, TRPM, EoE, SoQ etc think we cheat.) The key to our clan is a strong leader and very good teamwork, which most clans don't seem to have, just run around like headless chickens.
Goztow wrote on Fri, 14 July 2006 05:25 Leiw wrote on Fri, 14 July 2006 10:38 Yeah, we're making a known-cheater list too, we already got aroung 70 nicks and 110 ips, still working on it, I'll tell you when it's finished, perhaps that's the only way we can do something. I got more cheaters banned off my server, though. Maiden, how do you know if someone was/is cheating or not? At the moment no tests are valid anymore, theer are enough cheats that you simply cannot spot on screenshots or during a test. Even if you would ban someone, they could join back in your league as easy as they could join back in a public server. So how is keeping cheats out of your league so different compared to keeping cheats out of a public server? You don't even have a more or less impartial person in the game during the clan wars as one team will say they cheat and the other says they don't. Just to show i find "Result: no cheating at all in clan games" a bit weird. Maybe "no catching cheaters in clan wars" would be a more appropriate statement (meaning at least they need to be careful about which cheat they use). I think the big difference between the moderation on your server and on clanwars is that people like spoony are actually good Renegade players, and as such will usually know when someone is genuinely cheating, as opposed to the retarded shenanigans on the KOSs2's server.
Goztow wrote on Fri, 14 July 2006 04:25 Maiden, how do you know if someone was/is cheating or not? At the moment no tests are valid anymore You're grossly uninformed if you think that. "No tests or screenshots are valid" is usually what idiotic public server moderators say when they're totally convinced a skilled player is cheating, ask for a test, get proved wrong, but don't want to admit it or allow the player to be unbanned. (I think de7 probably knows what I'm talking about because I saw him in a situation like that on some public server or other, I forget which forum it was) Goztow wrote on Fri, 14 July 2006 04:25 Even if you would ban someone, they could join back in your league as easy as they could join back in a public server. That's what they all think. You'd be surprised how many cheaters/pointpushers tried to when they were banned/suspended and were caught immediately after playing their first game. So please, let us all in on your crazy plan. Goztow wrote on Fri, 14 July 2006 04:25 So how is keeping cheats out of your league so different compared to keeping cheats out of a public server? Because I won't ban someone without conclusive evidence. Again, you can't say that about A LOT of servers. Goztow wrote on Fri, 14 July 2006 04:25 Just to show i find "Result: no cheating at all in clan games" a bit weird. Maybe "no catching cheaters in clan wars" would be a more appropriate statement (meaning at least they need to be careful about which cheat they use). Or meaning I've ran such a scorched-earth policy on cheating in the past that 99% of the CW community knows it simply is not worth cheating, because doing so even once will result in being stripped of the only Renegade clanwar league worth mentioning. There are plenty of public servers.... being banned from one of them is hardly a big deal since you can just play in a different one. There is no Renegade league besides Clanwars.cc. Anyway, where's your evidence that the league is completely over-run by cheaters at the moment? I'm just saying, I'm one of the most active clanwar players currently, and play against just about everyone. There's a grand total of one person I've got suspicions about, so yeah.
Acey#GW wrote on Fri, 14 July 2006 10:42 I think this is where common sense comes into mind, you do have to allow for lag etc, and for the fact that players with nicks not known to you might actually be better than you. Its all about skill, and some people just can't take the fact there are better players out there than them. He's right, you can't ban anyone without testing, or being 100% SURE that they are cheating, otherwise good players will be banned from your server and what's the sense in playing a game in a server which you will always win just because the good players have been banned. At my mind, every clan- and communityserver should be more carefull about IP-banning for cheating. I think you have 3 minutes to test players who own you, right?
MaidenTy1 wrote on Fri, 14 July 2006 12:34 Goztow wrote on Fri, 14 July 2006 04:25 Maiden, how do you know if someone was/is cheating or not? At the moment no tests are valid anymore You're grossly uninformed if you think that. "No tests or screenshots are valid" is usually what idiotic public server moderators say when they're totally convinced a skilled player is cheating, ask for a test, get proved wrong, but don't want to admit it or allow the player to be unbanned. (I think de7 probably knows what I'm talking about because I saw him in a situation like that on some public server or other, I forget which forum it was) It was Goztow's server.
mrpirate wrote on Fri, 14 July 2006 18:00 Goztow wrote on Fri, 14 July 2006 05:25 Leiw wrote on Fri, 14 July 2006 10:38 Yeah, we're making a known-cheater list too, we already got aroung 70 nicks and 110 ips, still working on it, I'll tell you when it's finished, perhaps that's the only way we can do something. I got more cheaters banned off my server, though. Maiden, how do you know if someone was/is cheating or not? At the moment no tests are valid anymore, theer are enough cheats that you simply cannot spot on screenshots or during a test. Even if you would ban someone, they could join back in your league as easy as they could join back in a public server. So how is keeping cheats out of your league so different compared to keeping cheats out of a public server? You don't even have a more or less impartial person in the game during the clan wars as one team will say they cheat and the other says they don't. Just to show i find "Result: no cheating at all in clan games" a bit weird. Maybe "no catching cheaters in clan wars" would be a more appropriate statement (meaning at least they need to be careful about which cheat they use). I think the big difference between the moderation on your server and on clanwars is that people like spoony are actually good Renegade players, and as such will usually know when someone is genuinely cheating, as opposed to the retarded shenanigans on the KOSs2's server. BUrn.
mrpirate wrote on Fri, 14 July 2006 12:03 MaidenTy1 wrote on Fri, 14 July 2006 12:34 Goztow wrote on Fri, 14 July 2006 04:25 Maiden, how do you know if someone was/is cheating or not? At the moment no tests are valid anymore You're grossly uninformed if you think that. "No tests or screenshots are valid" is usually what idiotic public server moderators say when they're totally convinced a skilled player is cheating, ask for a test, get proved wrong, but don't want to admit it or allow the player to be unbanned. (I think de7 probably knows what I'm talking about because I saw him in a situation like that on some public server or other, I forget which forum it was) It was Goztow's server. haha, well, case closed. Goztow, if I ever want an admin who'll ban players without proof and without giving them a chance to prove their innocence on the grounds that "no screenshots and tests are valid", you'll be my first phonecall. Until then, kindly don't question Clanwars.cc's judgement.
Erm, sorry for disturbing you in your discussion, but this topic is meant to present the UACF and not to discuss if Goztow is doing his job right. At my mind he's doing a good job, perhaps that's why you have to be three to attack him and his opinions about testing cheaters. I just wonder how YOU would test e.g.: Damage hacks, or can you look what mousebutton the test-person is clicking?
Wow, that's a pretty smart articulation. Please mail me, when you're allowed to drive a car.
Leiw wrote on Fri, 14 July 2006 16:37 Erm, sorry for disturbing you in your discussion, but this topic is meant to present the UACF and not to discuss if Goztow is doing his job right. At my mind he's doing a good job, perhaps that's why you have to be three to attack him and his opinions about testing cheaters. I just wonder how YOU would test e.g.: Damage hacks, or can you look what mousebutton the test-person is clicking? Oh yes, banning people because they're better than you(obviously they MUST be cheating), is doing a good job.
I have never heard of a case in which Goztow abused his power and I've played for quite a while. If you have proves for this feel free to post them.
hmmmm....this went just slightly off topic....but then again that happens in almost every topic
Not only am I allowed to drive a car, but I am living proof that the KOSs2 are ban-happy. Refer to this link: http://thekoss2.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1369 for details. Next time, maybe, you will try not to look like such an idiot.
I read it and the only thing I have to say is that, in my mind, they have choosen the right decision. Perhaps you're angry because you got banned in a good server, that's probably why you are insulting me (moron, idiot, etc..), just make a new nick, play cheat-free and start to having fun with renegade again. It's not the end of the world just because you got caught once, just don't do it again. Reset your router, make a new nick and play. Edit: And please stop insulting me, thanks.
Leiw wrote on Fri, 14 July 2006 18:01 I read it and the only thing I have to say is that, in my mind, they have choosen the right decision. Perhaps you're angry because you got banned in a good server, that's probably why you are insulting me (moron, idiot, etc..), just make a new nick, play cheat-free and start to having fun with renegade again. It's not the end of the world just because you got caught once, just don't do it again. Reset your router, make a new nick and play. Edit: And please stop insulting me, thanks. Yeah, because a person would be mad if he got banned from a server if there were 50 more. Not to mention it's not good if they ban without any shred of evidence besides "i feel he was cheating" Wow. Very good. "in your mind", you're wrong, because there is no proof what-so-ever that him or me cheated. There is nothing they could say except one thing... he killed them fast. Which, sadly, is not near enough proof for someone cheating. As opposed to a fraps video showing conclusively a person doing more damage than they should. The same happened to me when they banned me. Absolutely no proof at all. The last moment before being banned I was fighting the admin and it was a 1v1 with deadeye vs black hand sniper and I killed him in 5 shots... One would think that if you're going to ban after that you'd have something to go on beside some "gut feeling" and besides, why would we really need to cheat? as far as gamespy clanning goes, i've played a fair few and gse was renown for back when it played and I was very good, so why would I, someone who's good(mrp), need to cheat? If a guy was one of the top players of say counterstrike, would you think he'd need to cheat? No, you wouldn't, so don't act like you have any knowledge about any of this because you started playing renegade since TFD. Been here for 4 years, I just *might* be good, ya think?
Leiw wrote on Fri, 14 July 2006 15:37 Erm, sorry for disturbing you in your discussion, but this topic is meant to present the UACF and not to discuss if Goztow is doing his job right. At my mind he's doing a good job, perhaps that's why you have to be three to attack him and his opinions about testing cheaters. I didn't. I defended myself against his statements, not the other way around. Leiw wrote on Fri, 14 July 2006 15:37 I just wonder how YOU would test e.g.: Damage hacks, or can you look what mousebutton the test-person is clicking? I'll give you an example. This is the last person I banned for cheating in the Renegade Clanwars.cc league - C4Packer. Here is my post on the CW forums explaining his ban: Quote: STiLLDr3x (packer) and Latuyanub (poison I believe?) vs me and big (big using spaz's name, me on the cheeters name) We raped them the first three games, even though it was obvious packer was cheating. The fourth game I took the opportunity to get some proof of what everyone knows... Map Field, us GDI. They had an art and a light, we kill the art (poison), packer is hitting our harv with his light tank. 8 points per shot, which is clearly augmented... the default is either 5 or 6 on a harvester with a light tank, as you can see... If that wasn't proof enough, later I get something truly damning. Fudgepacker is the light tank (as you can see by the points) 82 and 83 damage with single light tank shells. I think the majority knows light tank damage is 52. GG packer, you are now officially the biggest loser on this forum, and you also join Powergun in the banned club. Please reply by saying nobody other than you has a life ^^ There you have it. That is 100% conclusive evidence and it is irrefutable. I'll come back to that in a moment. Leiw wrote on Fri, 14 July 2006 15:37 I read it and the only thing I have to say is that, in my mind, they have choosen the right decision. Perhaps you're angry because you got banned in a good server, that's probably why you are insulting me (moron, idiot, etc..), just make a new nick, play cheat-free and start to having fun with renegade again. Smile It's not the end of the world just because you got caught once, just don't do it again. Reset your router, make a new nick and play. So what you're saying is that they or you do not need to provide any evidence whatsoever when labelling a player a cheater, nor are they required to give them a chance to prove their innocence. Let me repeat one of your posts. Leiw wrote on Fri, 14 July 2006 15:37 He's right, you can't ban anyone without testing, or being 100% SURE that they are cheating You say this, but you or Koss cannot provide the slightest shred of evidence that De7 or Mrpirate cheated, and yet you think it's perfectly justified that they are banned. Hypocrite, anybody? Compare that to the last person I banned from the Clanwars.cc league, where the evidence was completely incontravertible. Again, I rest my case, and I seriously question the validity of this "100% proven cheaters list", considering how bad your judgement is on the de7/mrpirate issue.
Oh by the way, as a former server owner allow me to throw in an opinion about that thread. If you don't have jack shit in the way of evidence, as Koss doesn't against De7 or Mrpirate, you are perfectly within your rights to revoke their ability to play on your server... hell, you pay for it, you can choose who gets to play there. You DO NOT have the right to label them a cheater and besmirch their reputation, as KoSS and Leiw wrongly did here. One final thing: several Koss players, as well as Leiw, give the pathetic "reason" for not requiring tests, screenshots, Renguard etc when banning or labelling a player as a "cheater"... that those three things are bypassable. Well, guess what. C4Packer was using a cheat that wouldn't show up in a screenshot, could pass a test by left-clicking, and Renguard didn't detect. And yet I had no problem whatsoever proving conclusively that he cheated, THE FIRST TIME I PLAYED HIM.
You checked the damage of a lt, right you got him, well done, but when you got banned, you were using a gunner. I don't know with how many FPS you play but I can't check the splash damage of a gunner because it's really hard to check how far from you the shot hit the groud on which you're standing on. And read my posts: I have never said you would be cheating, the only thing I said was that <you were caught>. I wasn't in the game in which you got banned, so I can't say if you were cheating or not, I just think that the thekoss2-players don't ban just because they got owned. And still you can't test damage hacks, even if you take 5 minutes to look at the damage of a lt when the driver thinks none's looking at him, you got one, yeah, nice, but how would you check the damage of a gunner?
Leiw wrote on Sat, 15 July 2006 02:54 You checked the damage of a lt, right you got him, well done, but when you got banned, you were using a gunner. wasn't me... Leiw wrote on Sat, 15 July 2006 02:54 I don't know with how many FPS you play but I can't check the splash damage of a gunner because it's really hard to check how far from you the shot hit the groud on which you're standing on. Leiw wrote on Sat, 15 July 2006 02:54 And still you can't test damage hacks, even if you take 5 minutes to look at the damage of a lt when the driver thinks none's looking at him, you got one, yeah, nice, but how would you check the damage of a gunner? How does this excuse banning someone without proof? Let me put this as plainly as I can. THE FACT YOU ARE UNABLE TO PROVE SOMEONE CHEATED DOES NOT GIVE YOU THE RIGHT TO BAN THEM WITHOUT PROOF. NEITHER DOES SAYING SCREENSHOTS ARE FALLIBLE, SAYING TESTS ARE FALLIBLE, OR SAYING RENGUARD IS BYPASSABLE. By your sad attempt at logic, I can accuse you of cheating and I don't have to prove it because screenshots, tests and Renguard are fallible - it's automatically a fact that you cheated because I say you cheated. Leiw wrote on Sat, 15 July 2006 02:54 And read my posts: I have never said you would be cheating, the only thing I said was that <you were caught> He was caught what? Stealing cookies? Masturbating? Your meaning is clear. Leiw wrote on Sat, 15 July 2006 02:54 I wasn't in the game in which you got banned, so I can't say if you were cheating or not, I just think that the thekoss2-players don't ban just because they got owned. And I think they weren't cheating at all.
DaN#GW wrote on Fri, 14 July 2006 18:13 Can i join [UACF]?
I did expect a lot of bullshit coming out of this, tbh, still I will try to defend my case without getting into any personal attacks like almost everyone else did in here. My statement that you cannot efficiently ban players. How can you even argue about this? If Crimson cannot keep Moee banned from renegadeforums, I ask myself how you can ban people that really want back in from yours. You must be aware that not only IP's change very rapidly today, there's also many other methods to keep anonymous on the net. Hell, ask DJM: he'll explain you. About the test you just provided. Good going, you caught him. I can fully understand you can do these things in 2v2. But how the hell do you want to do them in a 12v12 game? It's is nearly impossible. Moreover, our moderators also want to play the game. Our banning policy is maybe different than other servers, I agree on that. We take time to check players out but if we got enough suspicion (as in multiple moderators have serious suspicions) we will revoke your rights to get in our server. We will not ask for a screenshot as you cannot see cheats on them anymore. We will hardly ever ask you to shoot around the head in front of a rock because most cheats can bypass that. We prefer to ban one player not using cheats and 9 cheaters than to let 1 cheater play. We got a no swearing rule, no flaming and English only rule. People have been banned for that in the past. Why? Because they simply come in the game to start swearing, flaming or not speak English. Because they got multiple warnings and multiple qkicks-kicks in the past and seem to just keep doing it because they don't want to try to respect the rules. If you don't like the rules, you don't need to join. Same for our mods: if you don't like them, then why join them? Hell, if you don't like our server, then why talk about it on this forum? It seems that enough others still like it and our clan. I've seen one person in here replying in a decent and respectful way and that's the topic starter Leiw. He probably doesn't agree with our banning policy neather because he states he always wants 100 % proof before banning a player. That's his right. In no way I have judged your clanwar league in this topic, still I get personal attacks throwing to me by people. "Your moderators are worthless" "Your server stinks". That wasn't needed, was it? I just wanted to show you that you should be careful about calling your league cheatfree. You just prooved my point by posting a caught cheater. At least one clan war wasn't cheatfree: the one you played there. Quote: THE FACT YOU ARE UNABLE TO PROVE SOMEONE CHEATED DOES NOT GIVE YOU THE RIGHT TO BAN THEM WITHOUT PROOF. Ofcourse it does. The fact we own the server gives us the right to ban people from it. We do pay a lot of money for it. We actually do not try to make people look like cheaters to this community. If we talk about them, it's because they come to our forums. If people talk about them in other forums, it can be we state "he has been banned from our serevr for cheating". But I'm sure people like Leiw will not ban him for that as they want to see proove themselves first. Last but not least because I'm not going to come back on this topic, good luck with your clan, Leiw! Come to our forums for a funwar if you are intrested (click on my siggy).
Goztow wrote on Sat, 15 July 2006 05:18 I did expect a lot of bullshit coming out of this, tbh, still I will try to defend my case without getting into any personal attacks like almost everyone else did in here. I haven't attacked you personally. Goztow wrote on Sat, 15 July 2006 05:18 My statement that you cannot efficiently ban players. How can you even argue about this? If Crimson cannot keep Moee banned from renegadeforums, I ask myself how you can ban people that really want back in from yours. You must be aware that not only IP's change very rapidly today, there's also many other methods to keep anonymous on the net. Hell, ask DJM: he'll explain you. My point stands - almost all of them try getting back into the leagues, and nine times out of then they get caught immediately. Your statement is purely theoretical whereas mine is based on consistent experience of running leagues, and not just for Renegade, so yeah. Goztow wrote on Sat, 15 July 2006 05:18 About the test you just provided. Good going, you caught him. I can fully understand you can do these things in 2v2. But how the hell do you want to do them in a 12v12 game? It's is nearly impossible. Did you even try? Goztow wrote on Sat, 15 July 2006 05:18 We will not ask for a screenshot as you cannot see cheats on them anymore. Some cheats aren't shown on screenshots - equally, some are. Goztow wrote on Sat, 15 July 2006 05:18 We will hardly ever ask you to shoot around the head in front of a rock because most cheats can bypass that. equally, some don't Goztow wrote on Sat, 15 July 2006 05:18 We prefer to ban one player not using cheats and 9 cheaters than to let 1 cheater play. That's where we differ. I'll let ten cheaters get away with it before I ban one innocent player from my league, and I'll still wager my league doesn't have 10% as much cheating as your server. Goztow wrote on Sat, 15 July 2006 05:18 I've seen one person in here replying in a decent and respectful way and that's the topic starter Leiw. Then I guess you have me, Mrpirate and De7 on ignore. Either that or bias is clouding your judgement. Goztow wrote on Sat, 15 July 2006 05:18 He probably doesn't agree with our banning policy neather because he states he always wants 100 % proof before banning a player. That's his right. He did say that, and he also said he agrees with players being banned without any proof whatsoever. In other words he simply doesn't know what he thinks. Goztow wrote on Sat, 15 July 2006 05:18 In no way I have judged your clanwar league in this topic, still I get personal attacks throwing to me by people. "Your moderators are worthless" "Your server stinks". That wasn't needed, was it? What's that got to do with my league? I don't see the connection. Goztow wrote on Sat, 15 July 2006 05:18 I just wanted to show you that you should be careful about calling your league cheatfree. You just prooved my point by posting a caught cheater. At least one clan war wasn't cheatfree: the one you played there. I hate to burst your little bubble of alternative logic, but here are the plain facts: 1. An extreme minority of clanwar players cheat in clan matches - far less than in public servers 2. My system for judging cheaters innocent or guilty is INFINITELY fairer than any public server in existence (without a doubt fairer than yours) The C4Packer example proves my point, not yours. It was a situation where everyone in the community knew he cheated, but nobody could prove it. Then I played him anonymously and proved it conclusively - thus, he was banned. If we ran things the way you do, we'd ban him just because many players "knew" he cheated. Trouble is, you're wrong a lot of the time, so we go by evidence. Goztow wrote on Sat, 15 July 2006 05:18 Ofcourse it does. The fact we own the server gives us the right to ban people from it. We do pay a lot of money for it. I didn't word that well - I meant you shouldn't, not you couldn't. Goztow wrote on Sat, 15 July 2006 05:18 We actually do not try to make people look like cheaters to this community. If we talk about them, it's because they come to our forums. If people talk about them in other forums, it can be we state "he has been banned from our serevr for cheating". Leiw apparently does, with his "anti-cheating" community. No doubt Mrp and De7 are added onto their cheater list, despite their obvious innocence. But hey, let's not let minor little details like that get in the way. Goztow wrote on Sat, 15 July 2006 05:18 Last but not least because I'm not going to come back on this topic, good luck with your clan, Leiw! Come to our forums for a funwar if you are intrested (click on my siggy). I'd offer a funwar against either you or Leiw with my clan Taiwan, but I think it's a foregone conclusion that we'll just get accused of cheating and/or kicked from the game, so I think I won't bother.
Let's close this now, if someone is really this to join the UACF, they could join our server (Hostname: UACFhost) or check our forums. Thanks, Léiw.
So you acknowledge that you ban innocent players, and even though you know there's no reason to cheat to be good, if we're already are good coupled with the fact that we took the time to post on your forums and the fact that we'd have done anything to proclaim our innocence before you had banned us, doesn't mean anything towards unbanning. EVEN THOUGH YOU ADMIT THAT YOU DO BAN INNOCENT PLAYERS THAT ARE "ABOVE THE NORM" IN SKILL(DIRECT QUOTE FROM YOUR FORUMS)? By the way, at least when you ask for a test or ask for screenshots and what not, and they fail, you know for positive they are cheating, because I'm going to go out on a limb and say that maybe 1% of all cheaters would know how to 1. bypass 2. turn off cheats (I've never seen it done, i mean aside from something like right click, which isn't turning it off it means he's just left clicking, though there are other tests to prove a person is using right click, too) How many cheaters have you PROVED that used a damage hack such as right click or something? Generally the cheaters just use big head or final renegade and neither of which are entirely hard to spot. So, how many accounts have you proved people used a damage hack? none? So all we have on your "cheaters" list is your word, which, you don't even haev any proof that most of them cheat :\ Conclusion: apparently all tests, RG, and screenshots are now null in void forever because they are all possible to bypass. I mean, even in RG 1.04 It's STILL possible. So just because something is possible to be bypassed, does not make it useless to use when very few know how to. This is where logic overrules :\ Edit: and by the way, I posted in a respectful matter. All I said was that your moderators banned me without any evidence aside from a "gut feeling" which is *entirely* true. You've played GW, did you not find anything "above the norm" and consider them cheaters or accuse them of cheating? This is kind of where community players fall in line. Generally, they play in one server and no where else, and when some guy comes in, his first time, and he's something they haven't seen (because they've been playing on that server for so long and no one good has come in) They start thinking that it's impossible to be that good. Thus, cheating. If a guy went to a variety of servers he might find out that there are quite a few really good players out there, and many more better than himself. Not that I'm going to say a person should go to other servers, just that it's a flaw in deciding "what the norm" is at all. I'm all for people having fun just playing in one server, the point is to have fun. Just saying - you go to one server only and your chances of playing against great players is very small. especially when you ban them :\
By the way: Mrp and De7 are not on our cheater list, we don't check every forum and search threads about cheating to add players who get accused of cheating to our list. We really take care that our list is 100% full of cheaters, not of good players or <maybe cheaters>. thekoss2 just do their job, they try to host a balanced, fair and cheatfree server, it's not the end of the world if you're banned there, I mean, they could host a non-public server too, where just good and fair players or clanmembers and allies could join, but they're ruling a public one: So please let us end this, thanks(again ), Léiw.
Tbh: we played GW and we NEVER thought they were cheating. Why? Because they are a very strong group/team but they do not do things that seem impossible individually. I didn't get one shot from them that made me go "WTF". They are just very strong as a group. That being said, they aren't unbeatable: unbeatable is none. They are just very strong . We played them twice for now but we'll probably play them in the future. I must admit I will have difficulties finding players to play against them, but that's not because they would cheat or would be dickheads but because we know we hardly stand a chance.
Really goztow? man, my clan vs yours we had a series...4 games, 1 map of our choice, 1 of theirs, played each side on each map. We won 2, lost 2
Are you talking about GW, troop? haha. I guess de7 basically outlined everything I have to say, but I'll still say this: perhaps myself and de7 were "outside" the norm because you're banning 1 non-cheater for every 9 cheaters and therefore remove the more skilled players from your server.
trooprm02 wrote on Sat, 15 July 2006 16:35 we had a series...4 games, 1 map of our choice, 1 of theirs, played each side on each map. We won 2, lost 2 hahaha i'd love to see the screenshots mate, seeing as we only played 2 maps and you lost them both http://dynclan.net/dynclan/warplaner/extwars.php?action=deta ils&NMR=150271&clan=50117 Sniper_De7 http://www.gateway-gaming.com/adam/Renegade/game2%202006-06- 25%2020-03-00-95.png Walls Flying NOD 3v5 - enough said.
Trooprm, I'll be happy to play you guys. Come to our forums and challenge us. We're always in for a planned funwar.
ROFL, what ever happened to the 4 games? exactly.
...Obviously there wasn't four games. Besides.. you lost against 3 people when you had 5...
And one of those 3 people hadn't played Renegade in months.
DaN#GW wrote on Sat, 15 July 2006 10:18 Walls Flying NOD 3v5 - enough said. HAHAHA, nice.
Goztow wrote on Sat, 15 July 2006 15:53 Tbh: we played GW and we NEVER thought they were cheating. Why? Because they are a very strong group/team but they do not do things that seem impossible individually. I didn't get one shot from them that made me go "WTF". They are just very strong as a group. That being said, they aren't unbeatable: unbeatable is none. They are just very strong . We played them twice for now but we'll probably play them in the future. I must admit I will have difficulties finding players to play against them, but that's not because they would cheat or would be dickheads but because we know we hardly stand a chance. That makes a change, i'd say most of WOL think we cheat( EoE,SoQ and others..) and practically all of GSA. So that makes KoSS about the only clan what doesn't. I find it funny as some clans won't say it to our faces and bitch behind our backs that we cheat etc. Because after we initially ventured into WOL, we found most clans saying to us, oh we won't play you, we've heard you cheat from EoE etc. And clans like DoR aren't worth playing anyway, saying we cheat and then rejoining with cheats themselves is just retarded,
Acey#GW wrote on Sun, 16 July 2006 17:21 And clans like DoR aren't worth playing anyway, saying we cheat and then rejoining with cheats themselves is just retarded, that RAF clan on GSA did that too when I played for #GW... dumb fucks. Hi, let's make some unjustified cheating accusations we can't prove, then COMPLETELY INVALIDATE THEM by cheating ourselves