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-= TUTORIAL: How Do I Make A C&C Mode Map? =-
HOW TO MAKE A C&C MODE MAP I've added a few links to a couple other great tutorials! I hope the authors don't mind. If you have a question, most likely you'll find an answer there. There you will find a tutorial for anyone! It goes from start to finish (through RenX and the Commando Editer) on making a good C&C Mode Map. I might make a more advanced one for making terrain, but we'll see. [ September 04, 2002, 17:15: Message edited by: Ingrownlip ]
We lost our UBB Code privelages while I was gone? That is freakin lame.
all ack and those fricken anti-EA people
Time to find a new forum, the flamers will figure out how to make porn out of smilies pretty soon.
Good info, although I'd like to point out a few things. Keep in mind these tips are for more serious map makers. You should never select the VIS collision option unless you are serious about getting VIS working. Doing it incorrectly in RenX will be a waste of time. You must make individual hidden, one polygon meshes and select the VIS collision option. In other words, you could clone each individual polygon from each of your plains (or anywhere the camera [ie, any infantry/vehicle] can move). To see what I'm saying, open the mp_hourglass gmax scene and ungroup the VIS group. If you want to be more professional, delete the terrain that is directly under the buildings (you can't see them anyway) and move the vertexes to the edges of the buildings. You can see examples in the buildings-setup gmax scene. I've found that you do not need to make a waypoint from the war factory/airstrip to the tiberium field to get the harvester to begin its routine. Just make sure you generate the path solve sectors and there's a waypath from the tiberium field to the refinery. You should compute the vertex solve before generating the VIS data. Doing it after could disrupt the VIS data and downgrade the FPS during crunch times. Other than that - great tutorial! [ June 26, 2002, 17:23: Message edited by: YSLMuffins ]
Oh, and don't delete the scripts folder when exporting! [ June 26, 2002, 17:28: Message edited by: YSLMuffins ]
muffins, the vis objects can be more than one poly I have multiple poly vis objects in c2r and so far so good.
Oh, See I didn't do that much with VIS and so I just figured...well thanks for the info. If you hide objects and export, the hidden objects will not be exported. This was just a simply way to explain. I especially like the "advanced" texturing stuff that I skimmed over. I think it really helps make things look better!
normally i understand things the first time thru but i just read that 5 times and all i have to say is what?
Hey wait a minute?! Haven't you already made and released a map?! If you'd explain a little more then I might be able to help you.
You can delete the scripts folder before you export (as long as your making a .mix). I did it for C&C_Mountain.
Very nice stuff, lotsa work went into that one, congrats! Missin' some tunnel explanation though, not that i need it, but it would even more complete if it was there. But you can leave that to me, i'm about to relese an advanced tunnel making tutorial and you can hook it up to that one if you want. Good job Ingrown, i always like your stuff. [ June 26, 2002, 21:22: Message edited by: zemekis ]
Yes, I would be glad to link any other tutorial that could help.
very nice tutorial, maybe now i can start some of my OWN AI Maps Dante
As far as I know, the editor grabs a hold of scripts.dll so deleting it while the program is running could have an effect on stability.
Has anyone heard anything from WW about the script.dll? Just wondered what the real way of doing it is. I did e-mail Dev, but he never responds, so I'm not counting on any response from Greg. Maybe the next release will have something.
Aaah... I'm a total new with texturing and I can't alpha blend, it doesn't show anything and making tib fields with your tut doesn't work very well. You're tut is very good but texturing ain't working with me. Maybe you could help me? Anyway, I need to texture the cliffs, the tib fields and the tunnels. It would be fine with me if you use my map for the rest of your tut cuz LunarLanding doesn't have cliffs or tunnels. thx here is a pic of my map http://www.renegademods.info/users/magic013/C&C_Highpower.jpg
Ok, well you see how I Vertex Painted the terrain? That is how I alpha-blended. To make a tiberium field: Select the faces you want, and there is a button in the modifier box called, "Detach," select that. Check Detach as element. Now just make a new texture-map (Using the tiberium texture and one of your choice) and drag and drop it onto the newly created element. It is best to alpha-blend from black to white. so try to erase all the vertex paint modifier in that area. Does that help? Make sure you have VAlpha checked in your W3D properties. I think I will do some expounding on that, as someone else asked me a similar question. But notice in the Lunar_Landing.gmax, I have made the tiberium field a separate element. It is better to do that then to make a new object.
If the terrain is BLACK when you export it, that is a different problem. I haven't really decided on the solution, but I think it has something to do with the amount of the polygons to alpha blend. Not sure though.
Greg, Could you help me out and maybe add a few things? I really don't know all the ins and outs like you do.
If it's black compute the vertex solve!!!!!! LOL my 7th time saying this.
No, it's not Black from the light...Black in the W3D viewer program.
I never use the w3d view program. It can't give you an accurate light perspective. It's easier to just export it and make it in Level Edit. You can update the W3d file and Level edit will recognize the changes without having to restart the program.
Press the "y" key in RenX? Ewwww! That just takes from modelling room. I prefer to have the most out of my modelling windows. You can make a plane from the create standard primitive objects rollout. Don't you hate it when you do all this work just for the criticism? [ June 27, 2002, 22:24: Message edited by: steggyd ]
Well actually the Y key has come in very handy for me! If your RenX seems as though you have lost all your memory and it won't maximize anymore...just hit the Y key and sometimes it resets it! But to answer your question, "Yes"
WOW, that is one AWESOME tutorial! Great job! Now to answer someone's question: If your mesh is coming out black when you are trying to make an alpha blend you may have forgotten to enable the "Valpha" option in the w3d tools utility. greg
Exelent tutorial, I've been waiting for a tut like this so thx. You could add on how to make and add your own textures with psp or photoshop pro.
I also need to add something about the Nod turrets... Just remembered. I'll update it soon.
I wondered if I should put something in about scripts. Do the defenses work without it? Mine did once, but I don't know why. I think I put the script.dll in the main folder (of LevelEdit).
aha, well, I didn't read it, but I see the half dome works. Excellent. I've been meaning to do that cause as a few people know I'm doing something that should speed Renengade play up. Saved me the work of doing a test map... heh.
Vertex Paint still is a problem with me, I need to understand it. But what about texturing tunnels like the tunnels in Under, is that going to be in your tutorial? (edit) is your newer version of your tut include the new options of the commando editor? [ June 28, 2002, 04:15: Message edited by: magic013 ]
I might be able to include a advanced tunneling tutorial, but not for a while. I'll see what I can do...
Thx, anyway I'll try to get texturing to work now, but for now when I use vertex paint nothing blends and the terrain is still black.
I know what you mean, but I haven't narrowed it down. I'm still trying different things.
THANKS! Anything that I should add or does it seem alright?! Does adding script.dll really help? I've done both ways, not sure which is right.
Yeah, np, it looks like you got it figured out!
hey, i found a bug, errr not really a bug but it could be, if you don't place your middle waypoint for the GDI's Weapon Factory outside of the [] , and you follow the pathfind blocker methods of Westwood, then it is possible that your harvester will not go to the first pathfind location.... (how i figured this out) well i have never been much of a graphic designer, so i kinda cheated, i loaded the C&C_Islands_terrain from the presets, and started the level fresh after going through your tut, i noticed that your middle waypoint for the Weapons Factory was not in the pathfind.. i decided to investigate after about 2 hours of cussing, drinking, and yelling at my cpu in the wee hour of the morning i figured out why it didn't work.. Westwood was sneaky and put the pathfind blockers flush with the ground, and unless you closed the doors, you could not see them, there fore when the harvester came out of the factory, it could not find the waypath (although you would think that it would). So i simply moved the center waypoint to just beyond the [] of the weapons factory and wala, it worked. I also noticed that you do not "have" to put the waypath from the weapons factory/airstrip to the tiberium field, they will get their in the shortest route, unless you have the tib out in the middle of nowheres ville Just thougt that i would share some info that i came across.. Dante btw, with the new mod tools, can you insert ladder tiles? (like i said, i am not a graphic designer) and where can i get some.... [ June 28, 2002, 15:25: Message edited by: Dante ]
Good to know! So if you want a vehicle innitiate path you have to put it outside the loading zone? Also, If you place the vehicle up a little from the ground, the airplanes will come out right correct? I did find out that the harvesters find the quickest way and that made me frustrated too, but if you put out the pathfind blockers and you dispay path sectors you'll see that the bluish boxes don't connect, which is good. I think I'll be doing some updating.
nice tutorial, but how do you add turrets?
Ok, you have to go to OBJECT->VEHICLE->Mounted->Nod_Turret and you can choose which one you want from there. And once you've placed them, go to BUILDINGS -> mp_Nod_Turret and place the controller on the turret. If that doesn't make them fire then we'll need to add scripts to it. Let me know if that works for you so far.
Thanks
Actually, Turrets don't need a controller to work, although does placing a controller on them have an effect on them like improve their accuracy?
So that's why those Hangman's Cayon turrets are so sharp!
AH-HA! I've found it! At least I think it will help you. You need to go to your material properties for that object. Look at pass 1 and pass 2's Vertext Material Tab and you'll see that on one of them the ambient and diffuse color is black. Turn both to white. Hope that helps!
lol, I used another tut and folowed the steps exacly and it still doesn't work. YAHOO IT WORKS!!!THX Now a new q. for ya. is it possible to blend more then 2 textures? Like with more passes. [ June 28, 2002, 12:42: Message edited by: magic013 ]
Yes I think it is, but I haven't done it. Use the Shader options...like Add, Multiply, Blend. Otherwise if you are going to do three alpha blend like...grass-rock-snow... I would split up the object in separate elements and assign the material to an individual element. Using the Black for the similar texture between each. Does that make sense? Grass - (Rock-Black) - Snow The reason I like using elements better is to keep the UVW modifier the same for every texture. [ June 28, 2002, 12:53: Message edited by: Ingrownlip ]
Look, I'm so happy I took a pic. You can even pick a color with Pick Vertex Color for more detailed blending. thx allot http://www.renegademods.info/users/magic013/Blended.jpg
Hmm, the vis part of your tut doesn't work with me. It gives an fatal error. Can you help me? thx
as far as the pathfinding goes, you just need to make sure that you don't put waypaths inside the on the wrong side of the blockers Dante
Quote: does placing a controller on them have an effect on them like improve their accuracy? Wow, that sure does! These things are deadly accurate now!!
I never really learned VIS techniques, sorry. But there are a few people who could help you.
Can anybody help me, I can't use the Build Dynamic Culling System option in the vis menu, it gives a fatal error but I don't know if it is really needed but it just doesn't work.
Placing controllers to improve accuracy?
Magic, you have to place the human pathfind generator, generate the path solve sectors, discard the VIS data, repartition the culling systems, then build the dynamic culling systems.
Well, those turrets are definately more accurate whatever's happened to them. What about these sam sites, they fire at aircraft now, but they have poor accuracy and are stealthed when not firing, the turrets hit my orca more than the sam sites did, if they ever did...
I haven't actually tried the SAM sites, but I would imagine that if we could put the heat-seeking missles on it (like the MRLS) they could get pretty accurate. Or do they have those on it already?
Well, I dont know what the sams have, but they fire in bursts of about 5 and they aint good at hitting moving aircraft...
I finally finished my map with your tut Ingrownlip, and it is a good tut. thx Are you going to add on how to make crate spawners and how to make a building with interrior and texture it with your home made textures or just on how you textured you're moonlander?
What about that map... Country meadows (??) how did that guy set up his sams? If my memory's right those sams were pretty lethal
Yes, I need to do some updating, but I can't do very much this week. I will try to do what I can. I'll keep you guys posted.
Back up for all those who want help. I'm away alot more this week-til-weekend so I won't be checking up on this thread as much. I will try to help if anyone has questions.
Happy 4th of July! Bumping this back up for those that just "tune" in!
This deserves a bump!
Thanks!
Any new people like this? Or has any new people seen it?!
My second map is almost done thanks to your tut but also with some help from Dante for AI mutants and some weapon spawners, here are some pics. http://www.renegademods.info/users/magic013/C&C_Tiberium_Temple1.jpg http://www.renegademods.info/users/magic013/C&C_Tiberium_Temple2.jpg http://www.renegademods.info/users/magic013/C&C_Tiberium_Temple3.jpg http://www.renegademods.info/users/magic013/C&C_Tiberium_Temple4.jpg http://www.renegademods.info/users/magic013/C&C_Tiberium_Temple5.jpg [ July 07, 2002, 06:56: Message edited by: magic013 ]
HELP! I'm trying to texture but nothing shows up. It all gos well untill I get to that UV paint crap. In your pics things were white and black in mine it jsut stays black. what do I do?
Hey magic those pics looked pretty good! Nice job. Rivendall, you might have to go to the object properties and turn on Vertex Shading. Simply right-click the object, go to properties and there is a box down at the bottom left. Try playing with turning it on and off and see if that helps. Otherwise, are you using black to paint or have you changed your color to white? And the last thought I had that it could be is in your UV Paint modifier there is a box that says shade...or something like. Try checking that one.
I haven't been around much because of a trip, and I will not be this week because of a trip as well. So anyone else who wishes to help out please reply to questions.
bump for n00bs Dante
No! What do you have a question about?
uhmm,,,, gregs tutorial is about as basic as it gets, so if you don't want buildings, textures, or walls, then follow gregs, else follow this one Dante ps.. think i could collaborate some of your brain into my help file?
I'm going to be a ways behind since I can't play with the new tools for a while yet! Especially since I haven't tried the TEMP preset thing that Greg told us about!
Could I see your help file Dante? Maybe I could host it for you.
Ok Back, but no one had any questions!
I HAVE A QUESTION!!! Anyway when texturing I had finished all the material editor stuff but when you said to do the uv paint it just wouldn't look like yuors. SO I tried it in leveledit and the texture wasn't there. SO what should I do?
I'm not quite understanding you correctly, but you used Commando to view your terrain and you say there is no texture? That could be due to not copying the used texture in RenX to the Level folder under your package name. If you are using custom textures then you will need to move them to the level folder. Otherwise, Commando uses the Renegade database for the "built-in" textures.
Rivendall, did you see the earlier post? Did that help?
real bump
Boink
i forget how to make multiple textures to one plane (like a tunnel) AGHHH *goes crazy and shoots himself*
quote: Originally posted by Nodbugger: all ack and those fricken anti-EA people SUPORT ANTI- EA... NO MORE EA.. westwood rocks. or used to. now ea has taken over.. ****.. "its on now, boy."
Did you figure it out Commander? I think it is easiest for tunnel textures to select the faces you want to be different and apply the material. If you get real good at it you could alpha shade in between. That way you keep the same UVW map for all the textures. And then once you are done you can flip the sides so that you see the textures only on the inside.
I have also released the LVL files for Lunar Landing for the people that want. Link is at the tutorial site!