Command and Conquer: Renegade Official Forums - RDF feed
type: channel
description: C&C: Renegade --> Dying since 2003™, resurrected in 2024!
items: Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
items: Re: Med tank vs Artillery Fraps

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Thanks to the following Remekpl: Fraps capturing and webhost Dancinrat: My opponent Wurmrat: Server host Doomflama: teaching me how to play field This is for FUD's benefit. An arty isn't gonna beat a med tank, right? http://remek.anti-freez.net/spoony/artymed.wmv Mobile Artillery: me Medium Tank: Dancinrat You might be thinking that's an unfair situation since Nod has the hill. Not the case. http://remek.anti-freez.net/spoony/medarty.wmv Medium Tank: me Mobile Artillery: Dancinrat What does this prove? Two things. 1. Tankskill is generally more important than what unit you're driving. (Which, I admit, is a point FUD was right to make) 2. Saying Arties suck in tank fights is the most retarded thing in the world
creator: spoonyrat
date: 2004-06-01T19:50:37-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Being retarded doesn't help much either, I have destroyed mammoth tanks with the pistol It took about 15 min. But I did kill it.
creator: Nodbugger
date: 2004-06-01T19:53:28-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: I'd like to know how you could bring a mammy past half health with a pistol...it would repair too fast asuming someone is inside
creator: Homey
date: 2004-06-01T19:57:58-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: I missed an arty shell near the end of the first tank fight. Can't remember the last time that happened
creator: spoonyrat
date: 2004-06-01T19:58:17-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: your ts talk button must be the same as the arty aimbot!!
creator: Homey
date: 2004-06-01T20:00:45-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Nodbugger Being retarded doesn't help much either, I have destroyed mammoth tanks with the pistol It took about 15 min. But I did kill it. Total bullshit unless you were on a multiplayer practice by yourself and was shooting an open mammy.... The artilley owns tanks like it should. The only problem is it very low hp makes it a very easy target. There are alwasy corners though to hid behind and shoot though. Quote: 2. Saying Arties suck in tank fights is the most retarded thing in the world
creator: Spice
date: 2004-06-01T20:18:00-00:00

Re: Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: spoonyrat What does this prove? Two things. 1. Tankskill is generally more important than what unit you're driving. (Which, I admit, is a point FUD was right to make) 2. Saying Arties suck in tank fights is the most retarded thing in the world thank you for finally agreeing with me, spoony: mahkra if you're a lot better than another player, you'll win in a 1v1 vehicle fight most of the time regardless of the vehicles involved. skill matters a lot more than what character or vehicle you have. mahkra the simple fact is that mobile artilleries can do massive damage, but they can also be destroyed quite easily and from the FUD page: FUD it's not going to last without engineer support for long ..., but it does pack a healthy punch, so you can at least be assured that you can do a lot of damage FUD Unless you're outside their range, I don't recommend taking on tanks with a Mobile Artillery as you will probably lose. Engineer support will often tip these battles in your favor, though, so don't be afraid to grab a repair buddy i really don't understand what the problem is... FUD is saying that arties are pretty fierce but they die easily. what's so untrue about that? also, in your first vid (the one where you're in the arty), that med tank driver sucked ass, and your arty still almost died. i don't really know what you were trying to prove by that... (oh, one other thing, too -- having a hill to hide behind is almost the same thing as being out of range... make some more vids where both tanks are out in the open on level ground, and see how well the arty holds up)
creator: mahkra
date: 2004-06-01T20:20:08-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Quote: Lightly armored and fairly fragile, it's not going to last without engineer support for long in a one on one fight against most other vehicles, but it does pack a healthy punch, so you can at least be assured that you can do a lot of damage before you'd die in a scenario like the one just mentioned. Note how it doesn't say that Artillery suck, but in fact commends the amount of damage that can be done against MOST other vehicles. There are two ways you can look at that: The technical way, where both tanks are standing still and firing direct shots at each other until one dies, in which case, against MOST other vehicles, the Artillery will die. Or the practical way, where driving skill comes into play, where you (just like your video) use terrian and movement to avoid being hit. Whichever way Deathgod meant to address it, I cannot say. So you'd have to ask him. But also note, in your first video, you did win, yes, but you also suffered a great deal of damage in doing so; being left with 65 hitpoints. Or roughly 2 two medium shots remaining. Now, given the nature of the guide, as stated, for the newer players, I'd say those 2 shots are pretty weak ground for saying that your artillery will own everyone at tank on tank action. Especially seeing how skill comes into play, (as we have agreed). Quote: Be careful when taking on enemy tanks with a Mobile Artillery; unless you can outrange them they're probably going to kick your ass, It's generally the same thing as I've stated before. Two shots isn't good enough ground to base that Artillery will own everyone at tank on tank combat. I would bet that an average of generally newer players would say that artillery lose in those situations more often then win. Which, of course, doesn't mean that they CAN'T win, but that wasn't the purpose of the guide. Now, your second video doesn't really count. Because it has engineer support, and we stated: Quote: Lightly armored and fairly fragile, it's not going to last without eng…
creator: Javaxcx
date: 2004-06-01T20:21:25-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: i just shot at it for a long time a while back during the first week the game was out. Ive also taken down the health of buildings with the pistol.
creator: Nodbugger
date: 2004-06-01T20:22:03-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: EXdeath7 Nodbugger Being retarded doesn't help much either, I have destroyed mammoth tanks with the pistol It took about 15 min. But I did kill it. Total bullshit unless you were on a multiplayer practice by yourself and was shooting an open mammy.... actually this is complete and utter BS under any circumstances (with the latest version of the game, at least. i don't know how things worked before the game was patched.) a mammy (even an empty one) will heal itself faster than a pistol can hurt it. it is IMPOSSIBLE to kill a mammoth tank with a pistol.
creator: mahkra
date: 2004-06-01T20:25:47-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: mahkra EXdeath7 Nodbugger Being retarded doesn't help much either, I have destroyed mammoth tanks with the pistol It took about 15 min. But I did kill it. Total bullshit unless you were on a multiplayer practice by yourself and was shooting an open mammy.... actually this is complete and utter BS under any circumstances (with the latest version of the game, at least. i don't know how things worked before the game was patched.) a mammy (even an empty one) will heal itself faster than a pistol can hurt it. it is IMPOSSIBLE to kill a mammoth tank with a pistol. no it isn't others have done it also.
creator: Nodbugger
date: 2004-06-01T20:30:59-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: One thing I noticed on the arty one. Is you hit the hill with your shell and still damage the tank. Seconds 19-22 watch and you'l lsee you fire, hit the hill, and the med's health go down.
creator: Slicer_238
date: 2004-06-01T20:31:01-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: It happens at least twice in the second video too. Also notice, in seconds 21-22, he gets back into the med, the turret is pointing away and the shell skyrockets but the artillery still gets damaged?? Sorry, this smells horribly like the time on volcano I came at your arty with a flamethrower, I was right up inside the minimum range, the turret turned, fired a shot above me (it couldn't aim lower) and I died. I was at full health. Edit, here's an example of how it was. http://homepage.ntlworld.com/k.livingston/range.jpg This is the same map and same position as it was that time. I was roughly where the reticle is positioned, maybe an inch or so nearer but definetly behind the turret. You were hitting the hand of nod or something.. as I started to flame you, you turned the turret round. As SOON as it was turned enough, you fired and I was dead. Look at the dot; that's where the shell hits. Shells do good splash damage, but that would be GIANT splash to kill a fully healthed flamethrower in 1 hit (instantaneous too, I might add) from that distance, which does not happen in this game. I am not going to forget this kill as it was complete bullshit and I see no possible way it could have happened legitimately.
creator: flyingfox
date: 2004-06-01T20:39:40-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Nodbugger mahkra a mammy (even an empty one) will heal itself faster than a pistol can hurt it. it is IMPOSSIBLE to kill a mammoth tank with a pistol. no it isn't others have done it also. using a pistol, you can fire off almost 13 full clips in a minute (including reload times). one full clip does a measly 3 damage to heavy armor, so in a full minute a pistol can't even do 40 damage to a mammoth tank. after its armor is gone, a mammy will regenerate 2 points of health every second, which is 120 points of health per minute. you would need FOUR pistols shooting the mammy at once to kill it. i repeat: it is IMPOSSIBLE to kill a mammoth tank with *A* pistol.
creator: mahkra
date: 2004-06-01T20:46:39-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: mahkra Nodbugger mahkra a mammy (even an empty one) will heal itself faster than a pistol can hurt it. it is IMPOSSIBLE to kill a mammoth tank with a pistol. no it isn't others have done it also. using a pistol, you can fire off almost 13 full clips in a minute (including reload times). one full clip does a measly 3 damage to heavy armor, so in a full minute a pistol can't even do 40 damage to a mammoth tank. after its armor is gone, a mammy will regenerate 2 points of health every second, which is 120 points of health per minute. you would need FOUR pistols shooting the mammy at once to kill it. i repeat: it is IMPOSSIBLE to kill a mammoth tank with *A* pistol. well i have done it before.
creator: Nodbugger
date: 2004-06-01T20:48:00-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Nodbugger well i have done it before. yes, and as you stated earlier, it was Nodbugger back during the first week the game was out and like i said, mahkra it is IMPOSSIBLE to kill a mammoth tank with a pistol. mahkra (with the latest version of the game, at least. i don't know how things worked before the game was patched.)
creator: mahkra
date: 2004-06-01T20:52:20-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: You guys know what the aiming is? That is where the servers sees him aiming, that is why you don't get splash, or have to shoot at a building for like 10seconds before damage is done, the server sees you aiming at a wall while the turret is slowly moving around. This is why when your the host you see people shooting at walls will tanks, you cannot get splash, but if you hit vehicles or infantry with the shell damage counts but still not as much as it should since splash hurts the tank too.
creator: Homey
date: 2004-06-01T20:59:11-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: I didn't have engineer support. I WAS the Hotwire. Remekpl, the passenger, didn't do anything at all except record the tank fight on fraps. Remember those videos aren't from my viewpoint, they're from my passenger's viewpoint. That's why the aiming is screwed up, especially since Remek's FPS is reduced by the fraps.
creator: spoonyrat
date: 2004-06-01T21:12:24-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Javaxcx I'd say those 2 shots are pretty weak ground for saying that your artillery will own everyone at tank on tank action. I didn't say any amateur could kill a med with an arty nine times out of ten. I said a good arty player could. Of all the ground vehicles arty usage probably takes the most skill to master, except maybe the light+rav and apc+pic
creator: spoonyrat
date: 2004-06-01T21:20:45-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Still doesn't make sense how you hit the hill, your shell explodes on the hill, and yet you still damage the tank.
creator: Slicer_238
date: 2004-06-01T22:16:36-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: An art can take a med if they are able to dodge and repair when they can...the same can be said for the med. Sadly more often than not though that art loses because some minigunner is also firing at it, and its shitty armor is its weakness. Dont even get me started about being n00bjetted to death in 5 seconds. :huh:
creator: Blazer
date: 2004-06-01T23:42:55-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Slicer_238 Still doesn't make sense how you hit the hill, your shell explodes on the hill, and yet you still damage the tank. Homey You guys know what the aiming is? That is where the servers sees him aiming, that is why you don't get splash, or have to shoot at a building for like 10seconds before damage is done, the server sees you aiming at a wall while the turret is slowly moving around. This is why when your the host you see people shooting at walls will tanks, you cannot get splash, but if you hit vehicles or infantry with the shell damage counts but still not as much as it should since splash hurts the tank too. Go test it out with some friends with an arty, get them to drive around then start to shoot the wf when ur the host, you will see.
creator: Homey
date: 2004-06-02T00:31:15-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: You cant kill a mammy with a pistol its health will regenerate and compinsate for the damage you do when its armor is gone.
creator: Spice
date: 2004-06-02T00:35:53-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: spoonyrat Javaxcx I'd say those 2 shots are pretty weak ground for saying that your artillery will own everyone at tank on tank action. I didn't say any amateur could kill a med with an arty nine times out of ten. I said a good arty player could. Of all the ground vehicles arty usage probably takes the most skill to master, except maybe the light+rav and apc+pic Our guide, as STATED, was directed at the ametuer player, not this "good" player. Nor was the purpose of the guide to tell people how to master it. The guide explains the nature of the vehicle, not the intricacies involved in "mastering" it. Furthermore, engineer support implies "any means which an engineer repairs your vehicle while in a combat situation." So that includes you hopping out of your vehicle to repair.
creator: Javaxcx
date: 2004-06-02T00:37:44-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: But homey, in video 2 he damaged the arty when it was completely behind the hill.
creator: flyingfox
date: 2004-06-02T01:11:53-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: He hit the art there, you can hit an arty behind the hill in right places, although very hard to do in a med while moving when the art is too
creator: Homey
date: 2004-06-02T01:27:56-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: I applaud you for posting videos, but this reinforces what we've already said. Flyingfox: About the arty missing you and still killing you - chalk it up to lag and uber netcode. Happens all the time, especially with arties. I do that to people a lot on our server and I am always rewarded with a hearty WTF after they die in one shot. On my screen, I blasted their body into pieces at close range, but on their screen they were probably inside my minimum range or I shot past them. It works both ways, too... I've had times where I've clearly hit people right in the body from about 15-25 feet out and I do no damage to them until they get *farther* away, then they die in one shot.
creator: Deathgod
date: 2004-06-02T04:35:06-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: I knew the code was bad, but I didn't know it could be that bad. Bah, I wish it was as good as modern games. I always go when rushes fail because vehicles get hung up on things and slaughtered. Well, thanks. I'll take back my accusation, sorry.
creator: flyingfox
date: 2004-06-02T05:10:10-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: It doesn't count then because I got out to heal? So did the artillery driver. And an arty can be teched to full faster than a med, not to mention the only suitable place for me to heal was on the tiberium field. And PLEASE stfu about the mammoth/pistol issue, all of you. Start a new topic.
creator: spoonyrat
date: 2004-06-02T08:33:27-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: It can only be repaired to full armor in less time because it has less armor than the Medium Tank does, with a different armor class. Even if you had a vehicle that had 80 points of armor, it doesn't really matter. What does matter is if the repair rate outpaces the rate of damage.
creator: Aircraftkiller
date: 2004-06-02T08:39:33-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Fair point, but the reason an arty usually beats a med at the entrance to Nod base on Field (Assuming the drivers are pretty evenly matched in terms of tankskill) is the arty fixes quicker. Only vehicles a Hotwire/Tech can heal over are lighttank (non-rav), APC (non-PIC), humvee/buggy and orca/apache machineguns
creator: spoonyrat
date: 2004-06-02T10:04:06-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: The test was skewed because you were already on the field in a suitable position (i.e. behind cover in this case) when the med drove out. You had a hill to hide behind while he didn't. You could have camped even farther back so that he couldn't even hit you, in which case the med has no chance, which is what we've been saying all along. In a situation like that the med is going to lose every time. If you do that test out in the open, say on Under, and have both people drive out at the same time, the arty's not going to fare near as well. Again, I think it's cool you made some videos, but all you're doing is reinforcing what we've said already: arties do a lot of damage but are fragile.
creator: Deathgod
date: 2004-06-02T15:27:50-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Ahh, the medication will lose. Poor, poor medication... Oh, I'm sorry, did you mean "Medium Tank?"
creator: Aircraftkiller
date: 2004-06-02T17:25:20-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Priest, if you're not convinced, I'll make another fraps. This time I'll let a med tank move up and start hitting my Hand, then move out from my base and take him on. No range advantage and no hill for me to hide behind.
creator: spoonyrat
date: 2004-06-02T17:33:14-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Good old medical tank...
creator: Aircraftkiller
date: 2004-06-02T17:37:21-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Aircraftkiller Good old medical tank... Yours, or his?
creator: KIRBY098
date: 2004-06-02T18:03:18-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: spoonyrat Priest, if you're not convinced, I'll make another fraps. This time I'll let a med tank move up and start hitting my Hand, then move out from my base and take him on. No range advantage and no hill for me to hide behind. you're right - no hill... just A WALL. spoony, you've still got cover if you do that. and that's the whole point. artilleries are great IF YOU HAVE COVER (or engineer support). out in the open, an artillery will get torn apart. *maybe* it will survive 1v1, but if there are 2 enemies, that arty will die in seconds. and it's rare that there's only 1 enemy around. also, just look back at those videos you made. when you were in the arty, you won, but just barely. when you were in the med, though, you won quite handily. doesn't that suggest that a med tank is better 1v1, but you won both times because you're a better tank driver than the guy you made those videos with? oh, and ACK, what's the big deal about calling a medium tank a "med?" YOU once said the following: Aircraftkiller Looking at the fact that he got his point across... and it was perfectly legible... if getting one's point across is really all that matters, why do you make such a big deal out of things like "med" or "skin" or the like? and if tiny little things like that ARE a big deal, then why did you yell at Deathgod for making fun of someone's bad grammar in a different thread a couple weeks ago? also, according to medi-lexicon, an online medical abbreviations dictionary, med is an accepted abbreviation for the following: medial, median, medication, medicine, medical, MEDIUM. if you can't figure out that 'med' is supposed to mean 'medium' (which is obviously short for 'medium tank') in deathgod's post, you probably shouldn't be talking so much.
creator: mahkra
date: 2004-06-02T18:13:25-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: I said that, but it doesn't mean I approved of his garbage writing. "med" is short for "medical," not "medium." It cannot take that much effort to type out Medium Tank; seeing as how it took me less than a second.
creator: Aircraftkiller
date: 2004-06-02T18:20:26-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: That arguement is only valid if the "med" slang usage is misleading, or detracting to the agrument at hand. I fail to see how using abbreviation one time, has any bearing on the issue at hand, which is the survivability of a Mobile Artillery, versus a Medium tank. If he was typing " so then i got in my med at the med facility and met this med student getting into his med sized medical med" Then there's a problem. How about adding useful, and supporting info to a constructive arguement rather than trolling for spelling errors?
creator: KIRBY098
date: 2004-06-02T18:26:03-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Aircraftkiller "med" is short for "medical," not "medium." did you actually read my entire post? i looked up 'med' in a MEDICAL DICTIONARY, and it said that it was an accepted abbreviation for a number of things, one of which was 'medium.' 'med' happens to be one of those things that can mean more than one thing depending on its use. you're supposed to use these things called "context clues" to figure out which meaning it's using. god, ACK. do us all a favor and go back to 3rd grade to learn how to read.
creator: mahkra
date: 2004-06-02T18:29:26-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Quote: god, ACK. do us all a favor and go back to 3rd grade to learn how to read. If you haven't figured it out by now, I know how to read... And I don't care enough about this topic to read your entire post and make a useful reply. I'm here to stir up shit, just like the point of this topic was. Quote: How about adding useful, and supporting info to a constructive arguement rather than trolling for spelling errors? No. In this topic I feel like being an "all around instigator."
creator: Aircraftkiller
date: 2004-06-02T20:33:39-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Aircraftkiller I said that, but it doesn't mean I approved of his garbage writing. "med" is short for "medical," not "medium." It cannot take that much effort to type out Medium Tank; seeing as how it took me less than a second. You know, it takes me roughly the same amount of time to type out "you're a fag" and "FAG" but I far prefer the latter. Using 2 words to say something you could say in one is wasteful. I also find it amusing when you do shit like this, because you do the same thing. You should hold to your own standards, maybe then people wouldn't think you were a hypocrite.
creator: Deathgod
date: 2004-06-02T21:26:57-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: spoonyrat Priest, if you're not convinced, I'll make another fraps. This time I'll let a med tank move up and start hitting my Hand, then move out from my base and take him on. No range advantage and no hill for me to hide behind. I don't need convincing, I know what an arty can do. I also know what a good med tank driver can do, and what support can do as well. All of these tests, no matter what sorts of rules we set down for them, will be skewed, because they're not taking place in an actual game with other people involved in the fight. Rarely do you see one on one vehicle battles in Ren, except maybe in a 2v2 game. Playing Theorygade doesn't really accomplish anything.
creator: Deathgod
date: 2004-06-02T21:28:58-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Deathgod Aircraftkiller I said that, but it doesn't mean I approved of his garbage writing. "med" is short for "medical," not "medium." It cannot take that much effort to type out Medium Tank; seeing as how it took me less than a second. You know, it takes me roughly the same amount of time to type out "you're a fag" and "FAG" but I far prefer the latter. Using 2 words to say something you could say in one is wasteful. I also find it amusing when you do shit like this, because you do the same thing. You should hold to your own standards, maybe then people wouldn't think you were a hypocrite. The thing is, I am holding to my own standards... You're just being a "FAG" and reading what you want to read.
creator: Aircraftkiller
date: 2004-06-02T21:59:20-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Not likely, friend. Standards are static. Your behavior is not, but it is inflammatory as you said earlier. If your sole purpose for posting in this thread is to be a dickwad, more power to you.
creator: Deathgod
date: 2004-06-02T23:03:19-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Oh, the irony of this all...
creator: Aircraftkiller
date: 2004-06-02T23:19:16-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Deathgod I don't need convincing, I know what an arty can do. No, you don't. No one in FUD does, which is why whenever you get raped by a skilled arty player, you play the "OGM U CAN HOLD A MOUSE BUTTON DOWN ALL GAME U R SO 1337!!!?!?!?!" card. No-one who understands tankskill says that.
creator: spoonyrat
date: 2004-06-02T23:24:56-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: It takes skill to hold a bead on a moving vehicle or soldier, even though the Artillery itself is a very unbalanced and stupid unit... It should be firing a ballistic projectile that flies in an arc, taking much more skill to aim and use.
creator: Aircraftkiller
date: 2004-06-02T23:30:44-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: While not disagreeing with you on the way the nod arty SHOULD fire (In fact I'm fond of the way the renalert artillery works) I'm saying that if anything, body/headshotting with tanks takes more skill than with, say, a sniper rifle since you have to account for timing. Even more so with Artillery since you've got the inaccuracy to deal with.
creator: spoonyrat
date: 2004-06-02T23:55:15-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: "snipers" take very little skill to use. They're so powerful that it's laughable to think that they require any form of advance skill in aiming.
creator: Aircraftkiller
date: 2004-06-02T23:58:37-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: spoonyrat Deathgod I don't need convincing, I know what an arty can do. No, you don't. No one in FUD does, which is why whenever you get raped by a skilled arty player, you play the "OGM U CAN HOLD A MOUSE BUTTON DOWN ALL GAME U R SO 1337!!!?!?!?!" card. No-one who understands tankskill says that. This literally made me laugh out loud. I don't think we've ever "played that card" when we get owned by arties, because we DON'T get owned by them. About the only time I fear an arty is if I am an infantry unit and am out of my weapons range but inside an arty's range, and even then I'm not horribly worried. I understand tank skill perfectly fine, and I also understand that against a driver of equal skill on equal ground an arty will never win against a med tank. Both vehicles have the same rate of fire, and it takes 9 shots for an arty to kill a med but only 7 for the med to kill the arty. As I have stated many times before, unless the arty has a range/cover advantage or engineer support, it will lose.
creator: Deathgod
date: 2004-06-03T00:05:09-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: nice graphic card spoon
creator: Boxcarman
date: 2004-06-03T00:59:24-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: You mean "Nice graphics card Remek"
creator: spoonyrat
date: 2004-06-03T01:32:11-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Deathgod I understand tank skill perfectly fine, and I also understand that against a driver of equal skill on equal ground an arty will never win against a med tank. Both vehicles have the same rate of fire, and it takes 9 shots for an arty to kill a med but only 7 for the med to kill the arty. As I have stated many times before, unless the arty has a range/cover advantage or engineer support, it will lose. Since a sizeable chunk of tankskill is knowledge of the map and using terrain to your advantage (which isn't allowed according to you), it's pretty evident you don't understand tankskill at all. Yes, if you plonked an arty and a med facing each other and told them to start shooting at the same time, the med would win. What kind of idiot fights like that? Other than newbies and FUD players, of course
creator: spoonyrat
date: 2004-06-03T01:41:21-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: spoonyrat using terrain to your advantage (which isn't allowed according to you) by all means, using terrain to your advantage is allowed. but when one vehicle wins because of a terrain advantage, then you're not demonstrating VEHICLE superiority. you're demonstrating TACTICAL superiority. in a fair 1v1 fight, a med tank WILL WIN against an arty. the only way the artillery will win is if it has a terrain advantage (unless the med driver totally sucks, of course, in which case the arty can win on even terrain). in a real game, nothing's wrong with using terrain to your advantage. when you're trying to decide who will win in a 1v1 arty/med fight, though, you CANNOT give one vehicle a terrain advantage, because that will skew your results. with a big enough terrain advantage, a light tank can kill a mammoth. but no intelligent person would claim that means a light tank is better 1v1 than a mammy. this arty/med discussion is the same idea...
creator: mahkra
date: 2004-06-03T01:59:29-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: spoonyrat You mean "Nice graphics card Remek" yah
creator: Boxcarman
date: 2004-06-03T02:14:40-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: mahkra by all means, using terrain to your advantage is allowed. but when one vehicle wins because of a terrain advantage, then you're not demonstrating VEHICLE superiority. you're demonstrating TACTICAL superiority. Not the case. Of all the vehicles, Artillery can make best use of cover since its turret is so close to the edge of the tank.
creator: spoonyrat
date: 2004-06-03T02:15:37-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: what video card do you have remek. i need to get one, soo.. im kinda looking.
creator: Boxcarman
date: 2004-06-03T03:32:15-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: This is ridiculous. A Medium Tank beats an Artillery on flat ground if they're in range of each other. If the Artillery can stay out of the Medium Tank's range, the Artillery wins. Not that difficult to understand.
creator: PointlessAmbler
date: 2004-06-03T03:41:18-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Someone in this thread is having trouble with it, and it's not me.
creator: Deathgod
date: 2004-06-03T04:19:22-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Wow, for once we agree on something :/
creator: PointlessAmbler
date: 2004-06-03T04:34:12-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: You're talking as if every engagement is fought on a perfectly flat gaming field and firing commences mutually. By the same argument you could say a Medium Tank will beat an Apache every time, since it wins in terms of power vs armour. What you don't understand is that Renegade does not work that way at all.
creator: spoonyrat
date: 2004-06-03T04:56:21-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Obviously, on hilly ground, the Artillery could be driven so that it can get shots off on a Medium Tank when the Medium Tank can't retaliate. But conversely, a Medium Tank could sneak up on an Artillery and do the same thing. Basically, it's whoever's facing uphill has the advantage (or, if they're both facing uphill, whoever has more of their tank exposed to the enemy). I didn't say there weren't conditions. The Medium Tank beats the Artillery if it can close it fast enough, or the Artillery (stupidly) starts taking shots at the Medium Tank when it is inside the Medium Tank's range. Artillery wins when it can shoot at the Medium Tank at a distance. On hilly ground, whoever can utilize it better wins. I fail to see the problem here. What part of this isn't obvious? Everyone that posts here has surely beaten superior vehicles with inferior ones, because they utilized their terrain to make them more effective. Who hasn't killed a Medium Tank with a Light Tank, a Mammoth Tank with a Flame Tank, or even a Humvee with a Chem Trooper? This doesn't involve unit balance so much as it involves tactics. Better tacticians win. I'm not trying to argue a side here -- I'm saying the whole "ARTY SI BETTAR THEN THE MADD TANK" or vice versa is retarded. They both have their pros and cons. In a stand-up fight, the Medium Tank wins. It is the objective of the Artillery to make it as little of a stand-up fight as possible. Hell, it's possible to beat a Mammoth Tank with a Nod Buggy, although the driver of the Mammoth Tank would probably be comatose before that happens.
creator: PointlessAmbler
date: 2004-06-03T05:03:54-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
creator: Boxcarman
date: 2004-06-03T05:13:31-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: I never, ever said an arty is better than a med tank. Or vice versa.
creator: spoonyrat
date: 2004-06-03T05:18:48-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Ok, then what the hell are we arguing about? It seems to be nothing.
creator: PointlessAmbler
date: 2004-06-03T05:29:57-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: spoonyrat What you don't understand is that Renegade does not work that way at all. And finally you see my point, although I had to explain both sides for you to do so.
creator: Deathgod
date: 2004-06-03T06:28:20-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: I can see where you're both coming from and have indeed gained a lot more respect for FUD in this thread, however I could be conbstrued that your advice virtually writes off the arty to some newbies. Why not just say "in the hands of a skilled player the arty can be deadly, but it takes time to gain that skill". I know I can take virtually anything down in an arty, but I still prefer a med. On the subject of Lights vs. mammys I don't think I've ever lost to a mammy in a light, but then again that's just because I push the speed advantage, point being, use your advantage and you'll always win, let go off that advantage and you're getting owned.
creator: Phoenix - Aeon
date: 2004-06-03T11:33:28-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Phoenix - Aeon I can see where you're both coming from and have indeed gained a lot more respect for FUD in this thread, however I could be conbstrued that your advice virtually writes off the arty to some newbies. Why not just say "in the hands of a skilled player the arty can be deadly, but it takes time to gain that skill". in all fairness though, it's not really all that irresponsible to steer newbies away from the mobile artillery, because the arty is too fragile for newbies to survive long enough to shoot anything. (we've all seen it happen a hundred times, i'm sure -- newbie buys an arty, drives it out into the field to try to fight, can't even turn the turret because the camera isn't locked to turret, and blows up without firing a shot.) they should be using a light tank for tank vs tank combat, and they should only use an artillery in situations where other people are drawing fire away from them. (if we steer them away from arties, though, it doesn't mean they'll never use an arty. it just means that by the time they try to use an arty for tank combat, they'll actually know how to fight because of those skills they developed in a light tank.) if someone wanted to learn how to ride a motorcycle, you'd probably tell them to start by learning to ride a bike. i think this is kinda the same idea: an arty might be more destructive, but it's not a good vehicle to learn in. newbies should learn in something safer and then branch out to different vehicles later.
creator: mahkra
date: 2004-06-03T12:47:25-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Fair enough, it was only a suggestion from someone who is really only an average player with made better by experience.
creator: Phoenix - Aeon
date: 2004-06-03T19:17:26-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Page 4 yet....
creator: Boxcarman
date: 2004-06-03T21:49:26-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Nodbugger Being retarded doesn't help much either, I have destroyed mammoth tanks with the pistol It took about 15 min. But I did kill it. big lie... lmao
creator: Renardin6
date: 2004-06-04T08:52:39-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Remek, talk to me...!!
creator: Boxcarman
date: 2004-06-05T20:14:32-00:00

Re: Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: spoonyrat Thanks to the following Remekpl: Fraps capturing and webhost Dancinrat: My opponent Wurmrat: Server host Doomflama: teaching me how to play field This is for FUD's benefit. An arty isn't gonna beat a med tank, right? http://remek.anti-freez.net/spoony/artymed.wmv Mobile Artillery: me Medium Tank: Dancinrat You might be thinking that's an unfair situation since Nod has the hill. Not the case. http://remek.anti-freez.net/spoony/medarty.wmv Medium Tank: me Mobile Artillery: Dancinrat What does this prove? Two things. 1. Tankskill is generally more important than what unit you're driving. (Which, I admit, is a point FUD was right to make) 2. Saying Arties suck in tank fights is the most retarded thing in the world You just gave me a AWSOME idea for a website
creator: cowmisfit
date: 2004-06-05T20:19:43-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Boxcarman Remek, talk to me...!! I don't think Remek's ever been inclined to post here. Reach him at CW, non00bs.net or renstation.net
creator: spoonyrat
date: 2004-06-05T20:32:06-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Another point that seems to be absent from this discussion is that rarely it is the case that each team has only one tank on the field, and no supporting units. Renegade sucks as a 1 on 1 game. A more interesting, thought provoking chat would be what 4 mediums versus 4 arties would be like. My bet is on the arties winning if they concentrate their fire well.
creator: SuperFlyingEngi
date: 2004-06-05T20:32:27-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: SuperFlyingEngi Renegade sucks as a 1 on 1 game. 1v1s are AWESOMELY fun if played on a decent and fair map (Field, Wallsfly, Cityfly, maybe Under, everything else is unfair or just sucks) Everyone always says "1v1s don't prove anything". So what? They're fun as hell.
creator: spoonyrat
date: 2004-06-05T21:29:26-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Well, I personally don;t get much enjoyment out of a 1v1 game. I can have fun in 2v2s if I'm playing with friends, cuz I think Ren's a different experience altogether when you're playing with people you know personally.
creator: SuperFlyingEngi
date: 2004-06-05T21:57:54-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: SuperFlyingEngi Renegade sucks as a 1 on 1 game. Your not in a good clan are you?? Clanning 1 on 1 is great, its you or the other guy, you don't have 20 other teammates to be morons and screw up the game and make you loose, its all your fault if you loose, its all your glory if you win.
creator: cowmisfit
date: 2004-06-05T22:08:02-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: SuperFlyingEngi is right, this game IS boring in 1vs1 battles. This game was made for lots of people, because of the bases, and you have to defend the base. In most other games(UT, Quake, SOF, AVP...), you don't have to defend anything, so it does not mater if you die, because you won't loose anything, and you will just respawn. In renegade, if you lose building, it matters, because buildings can't be respawned, so someone needs to defend, and someone attack. One person is not enough to defend the entire base and attack at the same time.
creator: terminator 101
date: 2004-06-06T03:53:15-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: cowmisfit Your not in a good clan are you?? Clanning 1 on 1 is great, its you or the other guy, you don't have 20 other teammates to be morons and screw up the game and make you loose, its all your fault if you loose, its all your glory if you win. You're not in a good clan are you?? If you have to worry about your clan-mates screwing up a game, you might want to look for a new clan.
creator: exnyte
date: 2004-06-06T04:33:32-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Terminator 101 One person is not enough to defend the entire base and attack at the same time. If you play the game right, you don't need to do both. If you take an early offensive before your opponent can, you don't need to defend because he should be too busy saving his base from whatever you're doing. Later on, once you have a good lead or whatever, you don't need to attack, just chill out and let him come to you.
creator: spoonyrat
date: 2004-06-06T09:21:34-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: majikent cowmisfit Your not in a good clan are you?? Clanning 1 on 1 is great, its you or the other guy, you don't have 20 other teammates to be morons and screw up the game and make you loose, its all your fault if you loose, its all your glory if you win. You're not in a good clan are you?? If you have to worry about your clan-mates screwing up a game, you might want to look for a new clan. im not speeking of my clan mates, im speeking of in regular games regular morons screwing it up, my clan mates are the best of the best, they won't screw shit up for anyone, people like you who can't even read are the ones that screw shit up moron.
creator: cowmisfit
date: 2004-06-06T13:46:02-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: cowmisfit people like you who can't even read are the ones that screw shit up moron. How about people like you who can't type? You're half the problem.
creator: Javaxcx
date: 2004-06-06T20:47:42-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Javaxcx cowmisfit people like you who can't even read are the ones that screw shit up moron. How about people like you who can't type? You're half the problem. Everything you just quoted is typed correctly, no typos, i can type faster and more correctly than you can ever dream.
creator: cowmisfit
date: 2004-06-06T20:49:28-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: I only quoted what was necessary for what I was talking about. Your spelling and grammar skills are terrible. You have no grounds for mocking other people's literacy skills when you obviously have none yourself. Want an example? What exactly is "speeking"?
creator: Javaxcx
date: 2004-06-06T20:56:26-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: cowmisfit im not speeking of my clan mates, im speeking of in regular games regular morons screwing it up, my clan mates are the best of the best, they won't screw shit up for anyone, people like you who can't even read are the ones that screw shit up moron. So quick with the insult slinging, aren't you young one. In no way was my post insulting, or even negative in any way towards you. You seem to have this problem with keeping posts clean. Just because it's the internet, doesn't mean you have to fight with everyone that talks to you. Try growing up, will you? The reason I said what I said was because they way you stated this: cowmistfit Clanning 1 on 1 is great, its you or the other guy, you don't have 20 other teammates Implied you were compairing playing a clan game with 20+ teammates to a clan game one on one. Of course, if you were reading my post to see what I said, instead of with the "What can I attack back with" mentality, you would have probably caught that. Think about that.
creator: exnyte
date: 2004-06-06T22:19:17-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: exactly playing 1 on 1 is better than a game were you have 20 teammates, because its you or the other guy, if you screw up its all on you, can't blame it on your team mates.
creator: cowmisfit
date: 2004-06-07T00:21:24-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: You have already said that. Yet, when I replied to it you jumped all over me. I wasn't disputing what you said, mearly making an observation of what you were implying.
creator: exnyte
date: 2004-06-07T00:30:00-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: SuperFlyingEngi Another point that seems to be absent from this discussion is that rarely it is the case that each team has only one tank on the field, and no supporting units. Renegade sucks as a 1 on 1 game. A more interesting, thought provoking chat would be what 4 mediums versus 4 arties would be like. My bet is on the arties winning if they concentrate their fire well. Actually, a med can kill an arty in 7 shots. It takes an arty 9 shots to kill a med. And the two vehicles have the same rate of fire. Assuming no repairing, 4 meds would demolish 4 arties (If you assume the arties focus fire, then it's only fair to assume the meds do too. And if the meds focus their shots, they can kill an arty in 2 volleys. It takes the arties 3 to kill a med. etc, etc. If you keep going back and forth with the volleys, the meds will win with 1 completely unharmed tank and 1 at about half health.) This isn't realistic, though, because the arties and meds probably all have engineers or technicians inside. And once a vehicle dies, the driver will probably go repair the other vehicles. But anyway, the real point of this whole discussion (at least the point I've been making all along) is that mobile artilleries are strong but fragile. And they work better if they've got support. That support might come from other arties, or it might come from engineers, or it might come from light tanks. Or maybe some combination of the three. But an arty should not leave home alone, because it will not survive long on its own.
creator: mahkra
date: 2004-06-07T16:07:15-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: The 4 meds vs 4 arties idea really is thought-provoking, though. What if the vehicles all have engineers? What if they're all hotwires/technicians instead? Would it be better to focus on one vehicle or to kill all four at once so that there are never any engineers out on the ground repairing? What if people get out in the middle of the fight to repair? This is why I assumed no repairing. The problem's too complicated to have a simple answer if people do repair. (Also, what if one of the meds has a havok inside & he jumps out and snipes the engineers? etc etc etc......)
creator: mahkra
date: 2004-06-07T16:13:39-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: If the meds are driven by hotwires and the arties are driven by techs, the arties will win as soon as a vehicle or two is lost on both sides. Teched arties always beat "teched" (or should that be "hotwired") meds.
creator: spoonyrat
date: 2004-06-07T17:58:51-00:00

Med tank vs Artillery Fraps
type: item
description: Omfg. Who gives a shit lol. The videos were fun. Massive lolz0rs over here... LOL [zunnie]
creator: zunnie
date: 2004-06-08T01:30:11-00:00